Ismaili mazhab

Given modern distractions, the need to understand Islam better has never been more urgent. Through this forum we can share ideas and hopefully promote the true spirit of Islam which calls for peace, justice, tolerance, inclusiveness and diversity.
anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#121

Unread post by anajmi » Sat May 31, 2008 1:34 am

I started looking more closely at the concept of waseela in the quran as mentioned by tripplehorn. The most commonly used verse to justify Hazrat Ali worship is verse

5:35
YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! Do your duty to Allah, seek the means of approach unto Him, and strive with might and main in his cause: that ye may prosper.
PICKTHAL: O ye who believe! Be mindful of your duty to Allah, and seek the way of approach unto Him, and strive in His way in order that ye may succeed.
SHAKIR: O you who believe! be careful of (your duty to) Allah and seek means of nearness to Him and strive hard in His way that you may be successful.

Now unless you add taawil to this verse, the verse simply states to see a way to approach Allah. That way could be through Salaah, Roza, Zakaat and all the other things required by Allah from his followers.

A hadith that gets quoted is about a blind man who approached the prophet and asked the prophet to pray to Allah on his behalf. The prophet's prayer was accepted and the blind man's sight restored. That is waseela. Asking someone to pray for you, or beseeching Allah in someone else's name. The blind man didn't come to the prophet and say - "Ya Rasool Madad" or "Ya Rasool cure me". He asked the prophet to pray to Allah for him. He did ask the prophet for help but to pray to Allah for him.

Is that what the Ali worshippers do?

039.003
YUSUFALI: Is it not to Allah that sincere devotion is due? But those who take for protectors other than Allah (say): "We only serve them in order that they may bring us nearer to Allah." Truly Allah will judge between them in that wherein they differ. But Allah guides not such as are false and ungrateful.
PICKTHAL: Surely pure religion is for Allah only. And those who choose protecting friends beside Him (say): We worship them only that they may bring us near unto Allah. Lo! Allah will judge between them concerning that wherein they differ. Lo! Allah guideth not him who is a liar, an ingrate.
SHAKIR: Now, surely, sincere obedience is due to Allah (alone) and (as for) those who take guardians besides Him, (saying), We do not serve them save that they may make us nearer to Allah, surely Allah will judge between them in that in which they differ; surely Allah does not guide him aright who is a liar, ungrateful.

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#122

Unread post by turbocanuck » Sat May 31, 2008 2:23 am

listen, Guys, to this babboon...Ghilmanajmi this is true Islam?.....thats exactly what one would expect from a "Baazaru" upbringing. he has the audacity to replace Hazrat Ali with Turbocrap in "Ya Ali Madad", but then again these are the Donkeys who revere the filthy Sahabas who have portrayed Prophet Muhammad pbuh, as a Pedophile, wife abuser, murderer and a thief. so comes as no surprise.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#123

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat May 31, 2008 12:10 pm

you dont get it do you? porus tore you apart and YOU thought he had kind words for you?
Beveqoof Bafoon will not undestand Sunni Tawil. Br. Porus is sr. Scholar on this Board and deserves respect.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#124

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat May 31, 2008 12:12 pm

he has the audacity to replace Hazrat Ali with Turbocrap in "Ya Ali Madad",
Is turob gone insane. Take meds brother

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#125

Unread post by Muslim First » Sat May 31, 2008 12:44 pm

Br. Porus:

AS

You said:
Does not Allah say in Quran to obtain Waseela, a means of aproach to Him?

Now that is beyond bigots. They will post to ridicule.

I will not respond to them and I advise you to do the same.

Prophet did not leave the world before saying that he would leave behind Quran and Ali and his itrat. And that those who stick with them will come close to the first generation of his followers.
Please do not hide after trowing fire crackers.

Bevqoof Bafoon Turbooch has no intellectual capacity to debate, but I want you to read the following and refute the argument that Qur'an and Sunnah teaches us (Sorry not you but us Muslims) to worship Allah and Allah alone and seek His help alone.
-------


“---There is no help except from Allah the Exalted, the Wise.” (Q 3:126)

“If Allah helps you, none can overcome you; if He forsakes you, who is there, after that, that can help you? --” (Q-3:160)


It has been established by the verses of the Holy Qur’an and by the consensus of the Ummah that Allah the Almighty created all human being so that they may worship Him. He sent the Messengers and revealed the books to expound the manner of worship and the path of the mission. In this regard, Allah SWT states in Holy Qur’an:


“I have only created jinns and men that they may serve Me. (Q-51: 56)

“For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle, (with the Command), Serve Allah, and eschew Evil" (Q 16:36)

“Not an apostle did We send before thee without this inspiration sent by Us to him that there is no god but I; therefore worship and serve Me." (Q21: 25)

“Alif Lam Ra. (This is) a Book with verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning) further explained in detail, from One Who is Wise and Well-Acquainted (with all things):(It teacheth) that ye should worship none but Allah. (Say:) "Verily I am (sent) unto you from Him to warn and to bring glad tidings.” (Q 11:1-2)


It is clear from above verses that Allah SWT has created human beings and jinns but for one purpose only: to worship Him Alone and not to attribute any partner to Him. And He has said clearly that the Messengers (Peace Be Upon Them all) were sent to call for this worship and to forbid what is contrary to it: the verses of the holy Qur’an are clear and categorical in stating that Allah and Allah alone is to be worshipped. This worship implies faith in the oneness of Allah and obedience to Him, compliance of His commands and abstention from all that is forbidden by Him. Allah has ordained these tenants in numerous verses:


“And they have been commanded no more than this: to worship Allah offering Him sincere devotion, being True (in faith): ---“ (Q 98:5)


And


“ Thy Lord hath decreed that ye worship none but Him.” (Q 17:22)


And


“Verily it is We Who have revealed the Book to thee in Truth: so serve Allah offering him sincere devotion. Is not to Allah that sincere devotion is due?” (Q 39:142)


The verses dealing on this concept are abundant in the Holy Qur’an. They all point to necessity of sincerity in worshipping Allah Alone and give and give up worshipping all others including the Prophets. There is no doubt that “Dua” (Invocation) is a vital and comprehensive for of worship; it is to be addressed in all sincerity to Allah Alone as Allah the Almighty says in Holy Qur’an:


“Call ye then upon Allah with sincere devotion to Him even though the Unbelievers may detest it.” (Q 40:14)


And


“Mosques are built for Allah's worship; therefore, invoke not anyone along with Allah.” (Q 72:18)


This applies to all creations including the Prophets SAW because the word “Ahad” in Arabic is indefinite noun used in context of total negation. Therefore, it applies to all except Allah the Almighty.

Allah SWT says:


“’Nor call on any, other then Allah: -such will neither profit thee nor hurt thee.” (Q10: 106)


This verse is addressed to the Prophet SAW.

Needless to say, the Prophet SAW enjoys Divine protection from polytheistic beliefs; the purpose of this verse is to caution others. The Almighty says:


“ If thou dost, Behold! Thou shalt certainly be of those who do wrong.” (Q 10:106)


Thus the foremost among the mankind, namely the Prophet SAW has himself been cautioned that if he invokes anyone other then Allah, he shall be deemed as one who does wrong. What to say of other human beings?

It must be noted that word “Zulm” (wrong doing) is used in the sense of major “Shirk” that is polytheism. Allah the Almighty says:


“Those who reject the faith-they are the wrong doers,” (Q 2:254)


And


When Luqman, while advising his son, said to him: "O my son! Do not ever commit shirk (associating anyone else with Allah); surely committing shirk is indeed the highest wrong doing.” (Q 31:13)


It is evident from all these verses that invocation to anyone other then Allah whether they be from the dead or trees or idols, etc. is an act of joining others with Allah in worship; it contradicts the purpose of worship for which Allah has created human beings and the jinns and had sent Prophets (PBU Them) and revealed the Divine Messages to people and call them to act upon it. This is the meaning of the phrase “there is no god except Allah;” this statement affirms there is nothing to be worshipped except Allah SWT. This is stated in the Holy Quran:


“That is because Allah is the (only) Truth and because whatever else they invoke besides Him is Falsehood.” (Q 31:30)


This is the essence of religion, and the basic principle of our faith; no worship will be true unless this principle is truly accepted. Allah the Almighty says in the Holy Qur’an:


“But it has already been revealed to thee,- As it was to those before thee ,-"If thou ware to join (gods with Allah), truly fruitless will be thy work (in life), and thou wilt surely be in the ranks of those who lose (all spiritual good)." (Q 39:65)


And


“ -----If they had committed shirk (worshiped anyone else besides Allah) all their deeds would have become void.” (Q 6:88)


The religion of Islam is base on two great principles:


1. That Allah Alone is to be worshipped
2. That worship should be according to the path shown by the Prophet of Allah, Muhammad SAW.


This is the meaning of the “Shahadah” i.e. the statement of Faith: There is no god except Allah and that Muhammad SAW is the Messenger of Allah. Therefore, it will be contradiction of this principle if anyone invokes the dead including the Prophets or others or invoke idols, trees and stones, etc. and seek their help or seeks to gain favor from them by offering sacrifices of animals or vows or praise for them or prostrates to them. It will be act of associating others s Lords of creation besides Allah SWT. In other words, it will be negation of this basic tenet. It must also be mentioned that anyone who introduces into religion something which has not been permitted by Allah SWT will be failing to abide by the meaning of Shahadah that “Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah,” Allah SWT says:


“And We shall turn to whatever deeds they did (in this life) and We shall make such deeds as floating dust scattered about.” (Q 25:23)


The deeds referred to here, are deeds of those who spent their lives in polytheistic belief.

In this category of deeds are also included all contrived actions which are not permitted by Allah; these actions will, on the Day of Judgment, be like floating dust scattered about because it was not in accordance with the Divine guidance. The Prophet Muhammad SAW has said in authentic Tradition: “He who innovates something in this matter of ours that are not of it will have it rejected.” The above referred lady writer has addressed an invocation to the Prophet SAW and calls for his help. She has turned away from the Lord of creations in Whose Hand there is Victory as well as Defeat, Who Alone bestows help or loss or benefit; none other can benefit nor bestow any such thing. No doubt such an action is a serious violation and it is a “Shirk” (Polytheism), Allah SWT has commanded us to invoke Him and to seek His help; He has promised to respond; and He has also threatened with dire consequences all those who are haughty. He says: “And your Lord says: ‘Call on me, I will answer your (Prayers) but those who are too arrogant to serve Me will surely find themselves in Hell-in humiliation.” (40:60) This verse points out that Invocation is a form of prayer and whoever is arrogant, his ultimate place of abode will be in Hell. If such is the case with regard to one who has had audacity to avoid praying to Allah, what will be condition of a person who invokes other then Allah while Allah SWT is Omnipotent and Omnipresent? The Holy Qur’an says:


“When my servants question you about Me, tell them that I am very close to them. I answer the prayer of every suppliant when he calls Me; therefore, they should respond to Me and put their trust in Me, so that they may be rightly guided.” (Q2:186)


It is narrated in an authentic Tradition that the Prophet SAW advised his cousin Abdullah bin Abbas as follows:


“Remember Allah and He will remember you; remember Allah and ye shall find Him in your path; if you ask, ask from Allah; and if you seek help, seek from Allah.”


And he also said:


“He who dies while praying to someone as rival to Allah, the reward for such person shall be the fire of Hell.” (Narrated by Imam Bukhari)


In another Tradition the Prophet SAW said in an answer to a query as to which is greatest sin:


“ To make someone as rival to Allah, who has created you.”


So anyone prays to other then Allah SWT, seeks his help or gives offering to him or slaughters an animal or offers a prayer to him will be adoption someone as rival to Allah SWT, whether he be a Prophet or devout person or a king or jinn or an idol or anything else. As regards, invocation to a person who is alive and present before you, it is not an act pf Shirk (associationsm) because it is quite normal to seek the help of those around you in matters pertaining to the material life to the extend possible; it is normal and sanctioned practice among Muslims, Allah SWT says in Holy Qur’an:


“In the story pertaining to Moses: “Now the man of his own people appealed to him against his foe.” (28:15)


And another verse pertaining also to the story of Moses, Allah the Almighty says:


“He therefore, got away there from, looking about, in a state of fear,” (28:20)


Man therefore seeks help for his fellow human beings at times of war or at times of difficulties that occur to him and which require the help from others. Allah ordered hi Prophet SAW to convey to the people that he (the Prophet) does not possess for anyone any good nor any harm. The holy Qur’an states:


“O Prophet, say: "I pray only to my Rabb and worship none besides Him." (Q 72:20)

“Say: "I have no control to cause harm or bring you to the Right conduct." (Q72:21)


And


Further tell them: "I have no power to acquire benefit or avert any harm from myself, only that happens which Allah wants. Had I possessed the knowledge of the unseen I would have acquired many benefits to myself; and no harm would have touched me. I am no more than a Warner and bearer of good news for the true believers." (Q 7:188)


Quranic verses on this concept are many in number.

The prophet SAW never invoked anyone other then Allah and he never sought help from anyone other then Him; he beseeched Allah Almighty for victory against the enemy; he persistently prayed to Him saying “O Lord fulfill for me your promise.” He kept repeating these words to the extent that his friend and companion Abu Bakr said: “May it suffice, O Prophet of Allah; Verily Allah will fulfill his promise to you.” In this context, Allah revealed the following verse of the Holy Qur’an:


“ (Remember) When you prayed to your Rabb for help, He answered: "I will assist you with one thousand angels, one after another. "By this good news, Allah sought to comfort your heart, for victory comes only from Allah; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.” (Q 8:9,10)


Thus the Almighty reminds them of their call for help and how He responded to them by sending reinforcements of Angels to them and victory is not from angels, but Angels were sent to convey the good news of victory and contentment. He says:


“Victory is but from Allah.” (Q 3:126)


And


“Allah helped you at the battle of Badr when you were helpless. Therefore, have fear of Allah; perhaps you may become thankful.” (Q 3:123)


Thus Allah granted help at the Battle of Badr; the weapons, the power to fight and the Angels were all the factors that brought victory and glad tidings; They were only means by which the Divine victory was granted; victory is therefore from Allah only. So how could the lady writer referred to above or anyone seek help and victory from the Prophet SAW and turn away from the Lord of all creations and Omnipresent and Omnipotent?

No doubt, this attitude only betrays ignorance in its worst forms and indeed it is major act of Shirk (Associationism).

It is therefore duty of the writer to repent to Allah SWT in all sincerity and to never repeat such a mistake. Sincere repentance requires total conviction and compliance to what has been ordained by the Allah SWT. And repentance is with regard to the rights of any fallow human beings, such right should be returned to whom they belong or he (the repentant) should obtain an acquittal thereof. Allah has ordered his worshippers to repent and he has promised acceptance of their repentance. He says in holy Quran:


“And O believers! Turn to Allah in repentance; all of you, about you’re past mistakes, so that you may attain salvation.” (Q 24:31)


And he says with regard to the Christians:


“Will they not then turn to Allah and seek His forgiveness? Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.” (Q 5:74)


And Allah Says:


“Who do not invoke any other god besides Allah, nor kill any soul which Allah has made
Sacred, except for a just cause, nor commit fornication - he that does this shall be punished for his sin, and his punishment shall be doubled on the Day of Resurrection and in disgrace he shall abide forever, except the one who repents, becomes a true believer, and starts doing good deeds, for then Allah will change his evil deeds into good, and Allah is Most Forgiving, Most Merciful.” (Q 25:68,69,70)


And Allah says:


“It is He Who accepts repentance from His servants and pardons their sins, and He knows whatever you do.” (Q 42:25)


The Prophet SAW has said:

“Islam obliterates all that has preceded it; and repentance erases all the earlier (Wrong) actions.”

In this brief essay, the auther have sought to explain the magnitude and danger of the sin of Shirk because it is one of major sins. It is his earnest desire that readers should understand the issue in its right perspective and should not be misled.
---

In conclusion, I pray to Allah SWT to make these few words of use to Muslims and may he reform us all and make us proceed always on right path and fortify us with the knowledge of religion and steadfastness in adhering to it. May Allah protect us from the evils ourselves and from our bad actions. Verily He is the Protector and Sustainer. Peace and blessing of Allah be upon His slave and Messenger Muhammad and Members of his Family and his Companions.

.

porus
Posts: 3594
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#126

Unread post by porus » Sat May 31, 2008 1:00 pm

Originally posted by Muslim First:


Qur'an and Sunnah teaches us (Sorry not you but us Muslims) to worship Allah and Allah alone and seek His help alone.

I would rewrite it as:

Qur'an and Sunnah teaches worship of Allah and Allah alone and seek His help alone.

I agree with that 100% and all Muslims, Sunni, Shia as well as non-Muslims also agree with that.

Go through all my previous posts on this subject and I, guarantee, you will not learn anything.

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#127

Unread post by turbocanuck » Sat May 31, 2008 2:47 pm

Originally posted by Muslim First:
you dont get it do you? porus tore you apart and YOU thought he had kind words for you?
Beveqoof Bafoon will not undestand Sunni Tawil. Br. Porus is sr. Scholar on this Board and deserves respect.
Dear Muslimo Fascist,
AS usual lying like your filthy Sahabas...On one hand you tell us you respect Porus, on the Other you call him a kaffir!! like below:

posted May 30, 2008 03:27 PM by Muslimo Fascist

"I know you do not believe in Allah but you do have opnion."

I think YOU need to get on some meds, as your Camel Pee is having its Psychotic effects. LOL

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#128

Unread post by anajmi » Sat May 31, 2008 5:09 pm

turbocrap,

So now you are supposed to be an avataar of Hazrat Ali? You are nothing but turbocrap.

porus
Posts: 3594
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#129

Unread post by porus » Sat May 31, 2008 8:14 pm

Muslim First,

Revisit this thread. Read my posts.

http://www.dawoodi-bohras.com/cgi-bin/U ... 554#000032

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#130

Unread post by anajmi » Sat May 31, 2008 11:44 pm

Br. Muslim First,

You might also want to read all my responses to his posts in that thread.

jawanmardan
Posts: 398
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#131

Unread post by jawanmardan » Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:14 am

Bombs are being strapped onto mentally disabled people, in the Name of Islam.

Yet our friends here seem more concerned with attacking Ismailis because we regard ourselves as Muslim.

Ismailis see ourselves as Muslim, we have a history and theological approach to the idea of Islam that goes to the founding of the Madhabs.

enough Sunni and Shia Muslims are enlightened enough to see beyond the minority of militant fanatics represented on this board, too insecure with their own faith to start attacking that of others.

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#132

Unread post by turbocanuck » Sun Jun 01, 2008 2:03 am

[QUOTE]Originally posted by anajmi:
turbocrap,

So now you are supposed to be an avataar of Hazrat Ali? You are nothing but turbocrap.
[/Q

Thats not what your dimwit ditz said....... :D :D :D

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#133

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:07 am

jawanmardan,

If there was a person participating on this board who wanted to strap a bomb onto a mentally retarded person in the name of Islam, I would go after him just like I go after mentally retarded Ismailis.

Last time I checked, the Ismailis over here are the ones doing all the attacking, or can't you read and understand?

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#134

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:40 am

Here's looking at it from a different angle. The Americans are doing a fine job of going after the people who would strap a bomb on a mentally retarded person. So much so, that they have destroyed two countries and millions of lives to wipe out these types of people. And since they are doing a good job over there, I am left with the task of dealing with the Ismailis over here.

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#135

Unread post by turbocanuck » Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:28 am

Originally posted by anajmi:
I am left with the task of dealing with the Ismailis over here.
LOL :D :D :D

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#136

Unread post by Muslim First » Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:38 am

Turbooch

You are a Beveqoof and will remain Bevqoof until you start learning.
On one hand you tell us you respect Porus, on the other you call him a kaffir!! like below:
Kafir, an Islamic term usually translated as unbeliever similar to the Christian word pagan or Hebrew word koffer.

Dummy: Br. Porus has admitted that he is unbeliever.
.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#137

Unread post by Muslim First » Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:43 am

keeps on posting from ismaili.net, which HE thinks is an official Ismaili site.
Beveqoof;

You cannot learn anything from official sote. Iamaili.net and mostmerciful.com are only 2 sites you can find out what Ismaili thisn and do in their Jahannam Khana.
.

porus
Posts: 3594
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#138

Unread post by porus » Mon Jun 02, 2008 11:39 am

Originally posted by Muslim First:
Br. Porus has admitted that he is unbeliever.
I, along with 99% of the people of the planet earth, do not share your beliefs.

Unlike you, I belive in freedom of worship.

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#139

Unread post by turbocanuck » Mon Jun 02, 2008 11:53 am

Originally posted by Muslim First:
keeps on posting from ismaili.net, which HE thinks is an official Ismaili site.
Beveqoof;

You cannot learn anything from official sote. Iamaili.net and mostmerciful.com are only 2 sites you can find out what Ismaili thisn and do in their Jahannam Khana.
.
Dear Muslimo Fascist.
mostmerciful.com?? foot in mouth again. This retard meherally also thinks that hadiths are fabricated. that makes him smarter than you, mr Idiot.
http://www.mostmerciful.com/fabricated-hadiths.htm

He now panders cheap books to make ends meet with his monthly welfare cheques.
;)

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#140

Unread post by turbocanuck » Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:01 pm

Originally posted by Muslim First:
keeps on posting from ismaili.net, which HE thinks is an official Ismaili site.
Beveqoof;

You cannot learn anything from official sote. Iamaili.net and mostmerciful.com are only 2 sites you can find out what Ismaili thisn and do in their Jahannam Khana.
.
So you still read my postings.eh? i thought you didnt, but then again, you are known to be a liar on this site. Muslim First........ B.S. is what you are.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
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Re: Ismaili mazhab

#141

Unread post by Muslim First » Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:08 pm

This retard meherally also thinks that hadiths are fabricated. that makes him smarter than you, mr Idiot.
I am not interested crap he writes about Hadith or Qur'an.

I am only interested in what he writes about Ismailism and Aga Con.

turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#142

Unread post by turbocanuck » Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:27 pm

Originally posted by Muslim First:
This retard meherally also thinks that hadiths are fabricated. that makes him smarter than you, mr Idiot.
I am not interested crap he writes about Hadith or Qur'an.

I am only interested in what he writes about Ismailism and Aga Con.
Dear Muslimo Fascist,
please do enjoy Ghisa Pita B.S. Have fun.........LOL
:D :D :D

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#143

Unread post by Muslim First » Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:37 pm

AGA KHANI ISMAILI CULT AND CABALISTIC DOCTRINE

AGAKHANI ISMAILI CULT HAS NOTHING IN COMMON WITH ISLAM which is evident out of the following facts: -

(i) TAUHEED: - AGAKHAN ISMAILI KALIMAH DEPICTS HAZRAT ALI AS THE INCARNATION (tanasukh) of ALLAH, therefore ALI IS ALLAH AND IMAM HAZIR IS ALI. The AGA KHAN is the INCARNATION OF ALI. THE BEARER AND HOLDER OF NOOR-E-ELAHI. To join any one or anything in the DIVINITY of IMAM AGA KHAN IS SHIRK.

( ii): RISALAT :-(Doctrine of PEER SHAH) Our last and beloved Prophet Rasool-Allah, (p.b.u.h.) as per Aga Khan Cabalistic Doctrine, is the first PEER (hujjat) appointed by the first Imam Ali. Noor-e-Hidayat was granted to, ingrained into Rasool Allah (p.b.u.h.) by Ali. The function of the RasoolAllah was to propagate Islam at the instance, under the observation and guidance of Ali by virtue of the fact that Ali being the Imam is the holder and bearer of Noor-e-Elahie and this is the reason why Ali the Imam is the INCARNATION OF ALLAH.
All the subsequent Peers / Hujjats were appointed by the various subsequent Imams as a result all the Peers / Hujjats are the INCARNATIONS OF RASOOL-ALLAH and bearers of
Noor-e-Hidayat.

At certain times these Imams are keeping the office of the Peer / Hujjat within themselves. Under this cabalistic doctrine the Imam is considered both the Peer / Hujjat and Imam / Shah and is called PEERSHAH means the bearer of both the Noors viz.

(a) Noor-e-Elahie and (b) Noor-e-Hidayat, therefore, every such Imam is in the Incarnation of both Allah and Rasool. The present Imam, the Aga Khan is holding both these Noors, therefore he is both Allah and Rasool, and the Aga Khan is also invoked as the Peer of all the Peers meaning Aga Khan is the Peer of Rasool-Allah, CAN THERE BE A GREATER INSULT/ BLASPHEMY TO RASOOL-ALLAH (p.b.u.h.)??

(iii) QURAN: - (a) Al-Kitab, the Quran, according to the Aga Khan Ismaili Cult doctrine, is just a book which is SAMIT meaning deaf and dumb, Imam-e-Hazir, the Aga Khan is the Quran in Reality Aga Khan is QURAN-e-NATIQ MEANING THEQURAN WHICH IS TALKING . Farameen / Sermons of the Aga Khan are of the standard of the Quran, and often supersede the teachings and injunctions of Quran.
(b): According to the Aga Khan Ismaili Doctrine the Quran that the Muslims possess consists of changed text, a big portion of ten paras (sections) being omitted, and a sizeable portion added anew.

(iv) QIBLAH :- The BAITULLAH OF THE MECCA IS NOT THE QIBLAH IN REALITY. The IMAM-E-HAZIR, THE AGA KHAN IS THE QIBLAH IN REALITY. As per Aga Khan Ismaili Cabalistic Doctrine, Imam Aga Khan is the holder and bearer of the Noor-e-Elahie, therefore, the BODY OF THE IMAM AGA KHAN IS BAITULLAH IN REALITY. The DEEDAR = DARSHAN = vision of Aga Khan results into DISSIPATION OF ALL THE SINS COMMITTED.
This is the reason why the DEEDAR = DARSHAN ceremony is held whenever Aga Khan visits his cult followers. This ceremony is of the standard of HAJJ.

(v) NAMAZ = SALAT : -As there is NO QIBLAH, NOR QURAN in the Aga Khan Ismaili Cabal, the Namaz / Salat is absent. Aga Khan Ismailis do not offer Namaz as the Muslims do, therefore, Aga Khan Ismailis do not have any Masjid the world over. Aga Khan, to get himself recognized as a Muslim, donates occasionally some money to Muslims for the purpose of construction of Masjid in pursuance of taqaiya. Followers of this Aga Khan Cult do not offer Namaz nor observe the obligatory fasts of the holy month of Ramzan, but at the same to show off themselves as Muslims, they offer Eid Namaz, to hide their secret cult from the public eye of Muslims. Note: - All the sects who claim themselves as Muslims do offer Salat except Agakhan Ismailis and Zikries of Balochistan.

(vi) FASTS OF RAMZAN : - Aga Khan Ismailis do not observe these obligatory fasts of Ramzan. There is a popular saying in the Indo-Pakistan sub - continent that 'ROJAH YA KHOJAH'?! In pursuance of taqaiya they declare that they observe these fasts, but in the secret tawil these obligatory fasts mean [/B] 'NOT TO DIVULGE THE SECRETS OF ISMAILI DOCTRINE, OF THEIR CULT AND CULT PRACTICES, AND THESE FASTS ARE FOR ALL THE 365 DAYS OF THE YEAR.' [/B]

(vii) ZAKAT :- In lieu of Zakat there are scores of levies inform of sales proceeds of various notional spiritual services. A detailed Schedule of these services with the fees applicable is submitted herewith and Marked as Schedule-I Out of scores of the notional services a few are mentioned as under: -

(a) There is no salvation without payment of dashwand, which consist of payment of 12.5% on all the gross incomes earned. This is payable on monthly basis on every new-moon day and is required to be paid into cash only at the Jamatkhana under the jurisdiction one resides.

(b) ISM-E-AZAM is sold for Rupees ???/-.

(c) Life dedication for Rs.5,?????/- and there are higher grades viz. Fidai, Paternal love, Ishq-e-Imam etc, ranging from Rs.??????/- to Rs.????????/- but secrecy shrouds these services. By this and similar services Aga Khan Ismailis followers are fleeced away of their 30 to 40 percent of Income, which goes into the coffers of the Aga Khan as his private and personal property, no receipts are issued, Aga Khan is answerable to none and no one has any right or approach to the secret accounts.

(Viii): HAJ: - Aga Khan and his followers Agakhani Ismailis do not perform Hajj, as per their secret cult doctrine, Aga Khan the Imam being the holder and bearer of the NOOR-E-ELAHIE, the DEEDAR = DARSHAN = GLIMPSE OR VISION of his body, which is the house of Allah which is equivalent and identical to the Hajj and all the sins committed get dissipated by this DEEDAR.

(ix) JAMAT KHANAS: - These only Ibadatgahs for Aga Khan Ismailis are not constructed in the direction of Baitullah, nor the obligatory Namaz = Salat are not ever offered therein, nor any azan is ever heard from there. These are the places for certain secret Cult Practices known as Ismaili tariqa Ibadat. But one thing is certain that these Jamat Khanas serve as places of training of the murideen for the secret and conspiracy motives and this is the reason why hundreds of new Jamat Khanas are built in the Northern areas quite in disproportion to the population of the followers.

Every Jamat Khana has volunteer forces in the name and title of Volunteers of both men and women, Scouts, Girls Guides, Cubs, Blue Birds, Rovers etc., and there are ranks also viz. Captain, Major etc..

Danish
Posts: 1106
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#144

Unread post by Danish » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:48 pm

From most of all the above, it seems that Agha Khanis are more spiritually inclined, un-Islamic (as in an invented pagan cult unlike most Muslims are) and being "muslims" rather than a Muslim (with a capitalized "M"). Agha Khanis and Parsees are, in my sincere opinion, the best people around. Agha Khan is not only a spiritual leader but a very rational and logical person, unlike Burhanuddin and other cult leaders.

Danish
Posts: 1106
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#145

Unread post by Danish » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:50 pm

Originally posted by Danish:
From most of all the above, it seems that Agha Khanis are more spiritually inclined, un-Islamic (as in an invented pagan cult unlike most Muslims are) and being "muslims" rather than a Muslim (with a capitalized "M"). Agha Khanis and Parsees are, in my sincere opinion, the best people around. Agha Khan is not only a spiritual leader but a very rational and logical person, unlike Burhanuddin and other cult leaders.
Correction: (as in an invented pagan Arab cult like most Muslims are).

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#146

Unread post by Muslim First » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:31 pm

1. THE VARIOUS CULT (so called religious) SERVICES PERFORMED BY THE AGAKHAN AND / OR HIS DELEGATED AGENTS. *

2. THE NOTIONAL / SPIRITUAL BENEFIT THERE FROM. **

3. THE PRICE OR THE FEES LEVIED FOR THE SAME. ***


* Peculiarly and strangely, the spiritual power contained within Imam Aga Khan can be delegated by his whim and will to any person of any age or sex.
** This spiritual power can be re-delegated in turn to any other person by the person charged with this delegated power of the Imam Aga Khan.
*** There is not a single Cult Service of any nature, without Monetary Payment.

DASHOND=DASHWAND.

The followers of Aga Khan do not have any system of
ZAK'AT. In lieu of this Zak'at there is a system known as
DASHOND. The word Dashond literally means the tenth i.e.
ten percent = 10 %

Every Agakhani Ismaili must compulsorily pay 12.5 percent
on the total gross income. There are no exceptions nor any
exemptions, nor any lower limit. Every person, male or
female, minor or infant, all are equally liable to tender this
amount on every new-moon day on monthly basis. This is
compulsory levy, in the absence of which one is not entitled
to salvation and this failure leads one directly to hell.
The date of payment is every new moon night of the month
which is previously determined and announced in the Jamat
Khanas as per instructions of the higher authorities e.g. the
concerned Ismailia councils, irrespective of the fact whether
the new moon appears that day or not. Amongst the followers
of this Cult there is no uncertainty or doubt about this day of
payment.

For a higher grade of salvation one is supposed to pay 25 %,
twenty five percent of the total gross income. Those who pay
this higher percent i.e. 25%, twenty five percent of income as
Dashond are entitled to the membership of MUBARAK
MANDALI OR PANJEBHAI OF ONE-FOURTH. They arrange a
gathering / Majlees every month where at SECRET SERMONS
OR FARAMEEN OF THE IMAM AGAKHAN are read which
contain special blessings of the Agakhan. There is monthly
fees of this membership and faithful bear the expenses of this
Majlees.

In the absence of this payment of Dashond whether 12.5 % or
25 % no engagement nor marriage can take place, wedding
ceremony and funeral ceremony can not be joined by the
fellow AgaKhanies and the burial in the Agakhani grave yards
can be refused.

S A A R.

SAAR is also a kind of Dashond. This is also a compulsory
payment to be tendered by the bride-groom at the time of
marriage. This is payable in addition to the prescribed
registration fees and the fees for this service to Agakhan's
agent i.e. Chief = Mukhi of the concerned Jamat Khana under
whose jurisdiction this marriage ceremony takes place. This
Mukhi as the agent of the Agakhan calls for the list of all the
articles of the dowry including the cost of the clothes,
utensils, jewellery, furniture, and what ever other articles
given by the parents, other relatives and friends of the bride.
All these articles are evaluated and assessed as income to the
bride-groom and 12.5% of the total amount is required to be
paid on the spot, In the absence of which Nikah Ceremony can
not proceed further.
(after the declaration of the Qadianies as non-Muslims these
rules have a strange character i.e. from being compulsory to
voluntary, but so far faithfully followed.)

WADO-KAM, = MOTO -KAM, = KARE BUZARG, = BIG WORK WITH VARIOUS GRADES.

These notional Cult Services are sold by the Agakhan and /
or his delegated agents under the, trade name or the banner of
Spiritual services. The prices are graded upward depending on
the potency of the spiritual power ingrained within these
various grades of WADO KAM / BIG WORKS / KARE
BUZARG.!?!?!

GRADE - 1 :-(i) PONOSO JO WADO KAM

For adults of either sex.
(ii) LASHKAR :- For children / minors of either sex.
Prescribed sales price or fees :- Rs. Seventy Five for both (i) & (ii).
(i) Ponoso Jo Wado Kam :- The members who tender this
amount in advance become entitled to receive ISM-E-AZAM.
This ISM-E-AZAM is delivered by Imam Agakhan, personally. A
secret word termed as ISM-E-AZAM is granted by Agakhan
under repeated solemn undertaking that secrecy of this word
is mandatory. There is a legend amongst the Agakhanies that
in case one divulges the secret of this word then one becomes
a lunatic. Now this secret is no more in confidence. Imam
Agakhan IV has granted only one word AL-AALA as Ism-
e-Azam.
After receiving this word one is bound to get up very early
before dawn at the time of tehjud and go to Jamat Khana.
This is applicable to persons of both the sex. All these persons
males and females collect themselves in a big hall usually
uppermost floor of the Jamat Khana which is known amongst
the Agkhanies as BUNGLI. Children and minors are not
admitted. All collected perform zikra of that secret word. This
zikra is individual and lights are switched off. There is a
legend amongst the followers of this cult that by this zikra
opens the astral eves / sukshma chakshu, as a result one can
be a fortunate person to achieve the DEEDAR of the Imam
Agakhan. Deedar means to see or visualise.

As per this Cult belief ALLAH IS NOOR and THIS NOOR HAS MANIFESTED IN THE PERSON OF AGAKHAN, THEREFORE, HIS deedar IS EQUIVALENT TO SEE ALLAH PERSONIFIED IN THE FORM OF BONES AND FLESH OF THE IMAM AGAKHAN. THE SPITRITUAL ADVANTAGE IS IDENTICAL WITH HAJJ-E-BAITULLAH. (Deedar means to see or visualise.)

(ii) LASHKAR :- This is the same as the Pono So Jo Wado
Kam with the same sale price of Rs. 75/- Children of either
sex can join this. The only difference that the ceremony of the
bestowing of the ISM-E-AZAM is deferred to the later date
when the child reaches the age of puberty so that the secrecy
of the word can be safe guarded. The child who is not member
of this LASHKAR is looked upon as poor pitiable creature.
Note :- Practically whole of the community is member of this
grade of WADO-KAM. Just imagine how much cash income is
generated and swelled the coffers of Imam Agakhan. One who
is not the member of this KARE BUZARG is considered as the
third grade pitiable creature. This kar-e-buzurg can be
purchased repeatedly and posthumously (after death) by the
legatees.

W A D O KAM = K A R E BUZARG.--Grade II.

Grade II (i) :- Panj Sal Jo Wado Kam.
Sale Price Rs. 500.00.
(ii) :- Barah Sal Jo Wado Kam.
Sale Price Rs. 900.00.
It is an Ismaili Agakhani Cult Legend, and missionaries
attached to the Agakhan's Mission Department hammer into
the minds of the followers that in the past, it was compulsory
duty of the every follower to join the army of the Imam and to
dedicate five or nine years to this service without any
remuneration.
In present era Imam does not maintain any army and these
free services are not possible, therefore, out of Mercy on the
followers and to relieve the followers from this deprivation,
the Imam Agakhan has dispensed away these services and the
followers are liberated from the compulsory services of
five/nine years and spiritual advantage for five/nine years
services is bestowed upon the follower in lieu of Rs. 500.00
and 900.00 to be paid in cash in advance.

Notional / Spiritual Benefits:-
(i) One gets blessed by the Imam Agakhan of his choicest
Paternal, Maternal blessings.
ii) They are entitled to be the members and to attend the
Majlis called Nawmi Ji Majlis. Entry fees and monthly fees are
required to be paid.

GRADE III :- LIFE JO WADO KAM.

Sale Price Rs. 5000.00.
The notional / spiritual advantage is the whole life dedicated
for the free services in the army of the Agakhan. All the
advantages and benefit identical to Grade II. Difference is a
Class above.

GRADE IV :-FIDAI JO WADO KAM.

Sale Price Rs.25000/-
This is also known as Shaheed Jo Wado Kam.
Advantages :- (i) On payment of this huge amount, one is
entitled to Sawab or notional spiritual advantage of Shahadat
of the standard of Hazrat Hussain and his companions, in the
battle of Karbala. (ii) Other benefits include blessings of Imam
Agakhan and advantages of Majlis.

SPECIAL GRADES :- (i) Noorani Jo Wado Kam. in Africa it is
known as Shanti Jo Wado Kam. (ii) My Daughters' and (iii) My
Ladies Jo Wado Kam.
Secrecy shrouds these Kare Buzarg of Special Grades. Certain
facts have percolated. The Sale Prices vary as they are kept
secret but the supposed range is 25000.00 to 100000.00.
Advantages:- In Noorani Jo Wado Kam Agakhan bestows a
communion with the Imam in a Noorani way. For My
Daughters Kare Buzarg Imam bestows fatherly love on the
follower who has tendered this high amount whether male or
female. and for My Ladies Kare Buzarg Imam Agakhan bestows
upon the ISHQ of the standard of the love between husband
and wife, whether male or female. (The wonderful cult belief is
that the Imam Agakhan is male and all the followers are
considered as in female sex !!??!)
Note :-(a) Common factor in all these Wada Kam is Monetary Payment.

(b) Advantages merely Notional and Metaphysical, which are
in all these cases a total fraud and grand cheating.
(c) All these services can be purchased any number of times.
Can also be purchased for the benefit of the dead by the
legatees.

M E M A N I = M E H M A N I.

Definition :- Aga Khan in his capacity as Imame-e-Hazir is considered as OMNIPOTENT and OMNIPRESENT meaning IMAM AGA KHAN IS PERSONIFIED god as per Agakhani Cult Doctrine. His presence in the Jamat Khanas is always there in a Notional / Batooni / Noorani way. This presence justifies and deserves all the services as an V.V.I.P. Guest. These services are known amongst Agakhani Ismailies as memani.

Types of Memani :-

(1) Imam the Agakhan must be served with the best of the
dishes prepared at home or purchased. This is the reason why
every evening one never fails to observe that disciples of
Agakhan, the ladies and children in particular, carrying to
Jamat Khanas, the dishes and plates of the food, fruits.
Contrary to the common belief, that these dishes are meant
for the poor, these dishes &c. are auctioned and the highest
bidder gets the same on payment in cash on the spot; the poor
of the community just look on with the feelings of
deprivation.

(2) The Blessings of the Agakhan is a compulsive necessity for
any occasion of whatever greater or trivial importance. Fees /
prices for these services for blessings vary from Rs.51.00 to
251.00 as per variable potencies of the blessings. In addition
cable charges are also payable in advance. As per the advice of
his agents, Agakhan cables his choicest blessings. If the higher
fees had been tendered or the person is considered as
important and useful, then his / her name is mentioned in the
cable which is considered as a very high honour.
Some of the occasions on which, the followers hardly fail to tender the Memani :-

(1) On the arrival of the Imam Agakhan.*
(2) Imamat Day.
(3) Salgirah, (the Birth day of Agakhan.
(4) On Nauroz (as per Persian Calendar and Persian Tradition.
(5) On the birth of achild.
(6) On the Circumcision of the child.
(7) Son or Daughter's first day in the school. (8) Child passing school examination.
(9) The son or daughter joining college.
(10) Son or daughter getting engaged.
(11) Marriage of the son or daughter. (12) In case of death in the family.
(13) Opening of the new business. (14) Changing the place of business.
(15) Changing or acquiring the place of residence.
(16) Taking a new job or changing a job.
(17) Receiving an increment.
(18) Appointment of the follower to any honorary post in the internal administration of Agakhan, (19) Grant of a Title on the follower.
(20) While going for a journey within or abroad, and for safe return.
(21) Eid days.
(22) While going for Medical Treatment. **

Note :-
* Occasion of the arrival of the Agakhan is so auspicious and holy that hardly ever any disciples misses the chance to tender these money.

** This list can be carried to any fancy length. On any occasion of Bliss or Sorrow this Memani is a must.

A 'A B- E - S H I F A & C H H A N T

A 'A B -E - S H I F A:- Plain Tap water gets Spiritually or Divinely charged by Imam the Agakhan. Plain water is brought to Agakhan in a bowl by his followers. Agakhan dips his finger or sips a little or breaths into and lo! the water is immediately transformed into A'ab-e-Shifa!?!. Now this water is capable to cure all the diseases physical and spiritual and one can get cured of these ailments by its use in specified and prescribed manner.

This is not free. One is supposed to pay according to one's capacity. There is a legend amongst the followers of this Cult about the Historical Origin of this A'ab-e-Shifa :- In the past this community was worshipping Idol-gods like Hindus. The Idol-gods are required to be provided with regular bath (gusal). This washing of the idol-gods trickling from the feet was known as Charan Amrit (charan = feet and Amrit = nectar) i.e. Feet nectar. Now the pictures / photos of the Agakhan have replaced these idol-gods but the tradition is kept alive.

C H H A N T A :-

Definition:- This is one of the Agakhani Ismaili Cult Ceremony which is resorted to by every follower to get forgiven / dissipated, all the sins committed (whether committed intentionally or not). This is similar to Baptism but with very wide application.

Clarification :- (1) This community claims itself as one of the
sect of Islam. Yet it is astonishing to learn that this
community does not supplicate (pray) to Allah to get the sins
pardoned, whether committed collectively or individually,
with or without intention. Instead of Allah they beseech
Imam-e-Hazir i.e. Agakhan for the same. According to this
Cult Doctrine Agakhan is considered as the Mazhar /
manifestation of Allah, the holder / bearer of Noor of Allah, as
a result Imam Agakhan is Omnipotent and Omnipresent. This
is the reason why all the followers, in pursuance of this Cult
Doctrine turn to and beseech Agakhan to get their sins
dissipated.

Clarification :- (2) All the Chhanta numbering more than
twenty, of different types and of variable spiritual power or
potencies and therefore sold at different variable prices. For
the sake of brevity, twenty different types are enumerated,
but the details of only two are given :-
(I) Sutak Jo Chhanto :- (i) When a child is born, he or she is
taken to the Jamat Khana, under the jurisdiction of which the
person concerned resides. The Chief called the Mukhi, after
receiving the monetary fees, splashes some water on the new
born; according to Cult Doctrine legend, child undergoing this
ceremony, gets absolved of all the sins committed in the
previous incarnations and becomes Masoom. Please note the
doctrine of incarnations is alien to Islam. It is Hindu Doctrine.
Similarly Christians perform Baptism and Hindu Brahmin
perform the ceremony of DWIJ to make one SHUDHHA i.e.
absolved of sins of the previous incarnations.
(ii) At the same time water is also splashed on the mother
and she becomes Tahir / Pak meaning pure. There is no time
limit. Mother and child can be taken to the Jamat Khana the
very next day. There is no bar of pollution of the place of
worship.

Price / Fees :- This is variable depending on the status of the
person concerned, but it is levied in advance, and for mother
and child separately. Usually head of the family tenders this
amount.

(II) Mahadan jo Chhanto:-

Mahadan means the day of
Judgement / the day of Qayamah. This Chhanta is very
potent and absolves one, of all the sins of the past, present
and future, till the day of judgement. Being so important
these chhanta are purchased by every member of the
community. This purchase can be repeated for any number of
times. The relatives of the deceased can commit these
purchases for their dead relatives post-humously, and
repeatedly. The price for these Chhanta Rs. 51.00 minimum.
Definitely a very cheap bargain.?!?! What a novel system to
cheat the followers for the sake of money?

Other types of Chhanta :-

(1) Chhanta of Repentance,
(2) Chhanta of the Grave / Qabar.
(3) Chhanta of the Womb.
(4)Chhanta for not offering DU'A (in lieu of canonical Namaz).
(5)Chhanta for not paying Dashond accurately.
(6) Chhanta forfour YUG.(the Hindu four periods)
(7) Chhanta for the 52nd.street of Heaven.
(8) Chhanta for the pardon of all sins performed by the Agakhan.
(9) Chhanta of the Chhadidar.
(10)Chhanta of the Pool-Seerat.
(11) Chhanta of the Noor.
(12)Chhanta of the first journey.
(13) Chhanta of the secondjourney.
(14) Chhanta of the secret sins.
(15) Chhanta of theNineteenth Hall
(16) Chhanta of Chand raat.
(17) Chhanta ofre-admission in the community.
(18) Chhanta of Satada.
(19)Chhanta of Sutak.
(20) Chhanta of Mahadan. Price from Rupees 51.00 and there is no upper limit. More money paid to Agakhan more the benefit.

Note :-

(i) Most of these Chhanta can be purchased and performed any number of times.
(ii) These Chhanta can be purchased post-humously for the deceased members of the family and that's too any number of times.
(iii) All the fees or prices are levied in advance in cash, no credit no cheques.
How these Chhantas are performed ? :-

On the wall there is a big and decorated picture of the
Agakhan. In big centres this picture is of life size. Agakhan if
present, but mostly Mukhi the delegated agent of the Agakhan
or any other person of any age and of either sex empowered by
the Mukhi performs this ceremony. The person performing
Chhanta sits on a carpeted floor with a low table before him
on which there is receptacle containing A'Ab-e-Shifa*. The
person who is supposed to get these Chhanta joins his or her
hands against the over hanging picture of the Agakhan as the
Hindus do the same before their Idols, of course after paying
the required fees in advance. The person recites "Tobho Tobho
Takseerdar, Bundo sar ta pa guneh-gar.** "Thrice the water is
splashed on the face of the person and the performer recites
every time " ShahPeer Bakshe, Gat Bakshe.**" Lo! all the sins
committed are immediately get dissipated.!?!?!
Note :- * A'ab-e-Shifa :- Agakhan touches or breaths into a bowl
of tap water and it gets immediately charged with divine
power and termed as A'ab-e-Shifa. This water can be diluted
with ordinary tap water to any quantity but the divine power
remains undiluted in it.

** Translation :- "I repent, I repent, I am sinful from head to
feet." " Lord the Agakhan forgives and this congregation forgives."


N A N D I.

Nandi :- This word is derived from NA'AD meaning to call
aloud. Amongst the Agakhani Ismailies this has a special
/conventional meaning as per their Cult practices which
means auction / nilaam. Any thing can be sold by way of this
Nandi / auction in the Jamat khanas all over the world. viz.
Food stuff cooked or uncooked, Fruits, Drinks, Milk, Ghee,
Clothes, Cloth, Linen, Drapery, Furniture, TV sets, Radio Sets,
Bed, Mattress, Jewellery, Ornaments, Decorative Articles, Car,
Automobiles, House or Bungalow, Shawls including Shawls
laid on Coffins, and all other conceivable articles, tangible or
intangible can be auctioned by this way of Nandi. BUT ALL
THE MONEY COLLECTED BY THIS NANDI / AUCTION GO
DIRECTLY INTO THE COFFERS OF THE AGAKHAN WHO IS
NOT LIABLE TO ANY ACCOUNT TO ANY ONE AND HE CAN
SPEND THESE MONEY AS PER HIS WHIM AND WILL.

S U F R O.

Sufro :-
(i) Thal Sufro.
(ii) Awwal Sufro.
(i) Thal Sufro :- All types of food dishes laden with various,
delightful and tasty menu are taken to the Jamatkhana and
dedicated to (identical to chadawa of the pirs in grave.) the
Imam Agakhan. All these foods and other articles are arranged
on long but low tables, collectively is known as Thal Sufro or
Sufro. All these food stuffs and other articles, by virtue of the
fact that all these items having been dedicated to the Imam
Agakhan; become so divinely charged that all these articles
become Mubarak i.e imparting Barkat, and fetch very high
price.
All these articles are sold by auction called Na'ndi. All the sale
proceeds, which are always in cash, go directly to the coffers
of Imam Agakhan totally.
This Thal Sufro is very rich, in quantity quality and variety;
on certain ceremonial occasions. The coveted number Of
dishes is Menu of 52 types of very rich and delicious Dishes.
The richest one is on Nauroz i.e. the new year day as per
Persian Calendar and Persian tradition.
Awwal Sufro :- As per Agakhani Cult Legend, the notional /
spiritual benefit and advantage accruing out of all the this
Sufro laid and arranged on the table at one particular time is
called Awwal Sufro. Before beginning of regular auction /
na'ndi, this notional ( khayali) sawab (benefit) is auctioned.
The bidder is not entitled to any of the article, but, only the
notional benefit, On occasions the cash receipt of this single
auction reach astronomical figures e.g. The Nauroz of the year
1994, i. e.21,March; 1994, fetched in Karachi at one of the
Jamatkhana, Rs 65000/- and in London the value in terms of
rupees 620000/-.This Awwal Sufro is auctioned again and
again to attract buyers of the second and third position. Then
after this Awwal Sufro is offered at the price of the choice of
follower. Every member present takes this advantage
according to his or her capacity. In the end each and every
item is sold by auction. All in cash, no credits. All the money
go directly into the coffers of the Agakhan. What an ingenious
method to extort money from the followers ?!?!?

G H A T - P A T.

GHAT-PAT :- Ghat means a Bowl and Pat means a low table.
In Agakhani Cult a special significance is attached to this
ceremony. It is undertaken on every Friday evening,
New-Moon evening known as Chand Rat, daily early before
dawn, and during the seven day ceremony called Satada, and
other occasions and festivals. The tools for Ghat-pat consist of
:- a few bowls, some plates, and a number of crucibles, a
candle light or electric lamp. Candle light or lamp is placed
near the low table. All the bowls, plates, crucibles are washed
and passed through an incense. The bowls are filled with plain
tap water. A small bottle filled with water blessed by Imam
the Agakhan by way of his touch, or a sip, or breathed into, is
poured into the bowls, then these bowls are filled to the brim
and the empty bottle is refilled from this water and preserved
for the next time. This water in the bottle and the bowls are
termed as A'ab-e-Shifa, and as the name suggests it is
considered as the cure for all the diseases of body, mind and
soul, in other words the tap water gets divinely or spiritually
charged by the touch of Imam Agakhan and turns into elixir
vitae. A person whether he or she or a minor recites a DU'A of
Ghat-Pat. In the decades gone by, nine incarnations of Hindu
god were invoked and Hazrat Ali is crowned with tenth
incarnation of the God. The perpetual incarnation of Ali is in
the form of Imams, the present one is Agakhan, in other
words Imam Agakhan is Mazhar of Allah. In recent years the
invocation of Hindu gods is dis-continued or left out., but the
Divinity of Allah is planted into Hazrat Ali who is considered
as the bearer of Noor-e-Elahie and therefore Mazhar of Allah.
By virtue of trans-migration of this Noor-e-Elahie Imam
Agakhan is also Mazhar of Allah. After completing the
recitation of Du'a all the people stand up and begin to recite in
chorus certain rhymes called Ginans of Ghat-Pat, and all the
present begin to take one crucible and drinks the water from
it while standing, and utter the words farman Peershah. As
per Agakhani Cult Legend this purifies and enlightens
spiritually and all the ailments of mind and body are cured.
Origin of this custom or tradition is obscure. There are two
versions :- (i) Hindu custom of Charanamrit and (ii) Routine
custom still prevailing amongst the leftist followers of Hindu
goddess Shakti known as Wam Margi or Wam Panthi, the
lower most Hindu scheduled cast of India. The last point
remains to be stressed is that this A'ab-e-Shifa is not free but
one has to put some money on the table first, as per his status
and position, and there after to take the crucible.

GHAT-PAT JO DORO.

A twined thread tied around the bowl of the Ghat-Pat while
performing above ceremony also gets divinely charged and as
per Agakhani Cult legend, if this thread is worn on the arm or
around the neck, it is supposed to be the cure for all the
diseases of soul, mind and body.

W H E N A P E R S O N D I E S.

When A Person Dies :- Every person / family is under the
Jurisdiction of a particular Jamatkhana. When death takes
place in a family, the Mukhi i.e. Chief of the Jamatkhana is
immediately required to be informed of the death. This
information must accompany with (i) a pair of the best of the
clothes of the deceased and (ii) Coffin fees plus the price for a
place in the Agakhani grave yard. It is interesting to learn that
AgaKhan is the sole proprietor of all the Ismaili Grave yards.
When Gusal is performed and the dead body is ready for the
coffin all the relatives collect around the deceased and the
nearest relatives gets the sins of the deceased to be pardoned
by the Mukhi on payment of certain sum of money, minimum
fees / price is Rs.51.00. Mukhi splashes A'ab-e-Shifa** on the
deceased and all the sins committed during the life span are
dissipated away. There after other relatives one by one repeat
this process and in the end the friends, neighbours repeat this
ceremony. Every one is supposed to pay the prescribed fees in
cash on the spot. Then after Mukhi asks for Samar, Every one
present pays some money to the Mukhi as per his capacity or
nearness of relationship to the deceased. This Samar is
considered the hard currency during the voyage from the
grave to the day of Judgement (Qayamat).
In the evening all the persons who had joined the funeral
ceremony, all the ladies and children of the family and the
relatives, and all the other persons who were not able to have
timely information, collect in the Jamatkhana. Every one
carries with him a packet of sweets with him. The family
members are supposed to bring very wide and large plates
laden with sweets. A special DU'A is offered and every body
present is supposed to participate in this DU'A for which every
individual has to pay in advance certain sum of money.

Soyem :- All the Ceremonies performed in evening of the first
day are repeated, with the only difference that more people
collect in the Jamatkhana, more sweets, more payments for
the services of the DU'A for the deceased for which every
individual has to pay separately.
Note:- All these sweets collected in the Jamat khana is not
distributed free. Every one gets astonished to learn that all
these sweets are sold by N'andi / Auction. All the money
collected out of the DU'A and Na'ndi / Auction go to the
coffers of the AgaKhan as his private and personal property.

Ziarat of Daswee also known as GOL-DHANI :-On the 10 th.
day of the death this is special ceremony, which consist of :-
(i) This is a special gathering called the Majlis of Daswi.
(ii) Relatives, Neighbours and all the acquaintances are
supposed to collect into Jamatkhana to participate in this
ceremony. People and relatives come from far and wide and
undertake long journey to participate.
(iii) Family members and relatives must take to Jamatkhana
all sort of articles viz. foods cooked and uncooked, drinks,
crockery, utensils, clothes, cloth, Wearing apparels, Drapery
Dining-table with Chairs, All sort of Furniture e.g. sofa sets,
lounge furniture, jewellery, ornaments. All the articles that
can be gifted to a bride as dowry are supposed to be taken to
the Jamatkhana, (it is irrelevant whether the deceased is a
child, new born or an old lady in her nineties.), Motor car,
Bungalow, and all other articles that imagination can conceive
of.
(iv) All the relatives bring a packet of sweets.
(v) All the present have to pay for the DU'A individually.
(vi) All these Articles and sweets are offered to Agakhan.
(vii) All these articles including food stuff, sweets and every
thing without exception, even including the shawls covered on
the coffin case, are sold by auction called Na'ndi
(viii) All the money collected from the auction of the articles
and the services for the DU'A go directly into the coffers of
AgaKhan as his private and personal property.
Explanation :- It is one of the fundamental tenet in the
Ismaili Agakhani Cult that the soul of the Deceased Momin
(i.e. true follower of Agakhan and his Cult) dwells, finds place
or merges with the soul of Imam Aga Khan, i.e. the permanent
abode of the human soul is the soul of Imam Agakhan, this is
the reason why all the articles are offered to Imam Agakhan.
This is entirely un-Islamic, the source of such a doctrine lies
in the Greek and Hindu philosophies, this tenet of the Cult is
called "asal ma wasal".
S A T A D A .
SATADA :- The word Satada is a combination of two words
viz. Sata = seven and Da = days., accordingly, this ceremony
takes place daily early before dawn.
(1) When a calamity strikes any follower of Agakhan or any
family member of that follower, this ceremony is considered
as obligatory and takes place in the Jamatkhana under whose
Jurisdiction, he / she resides.
(2) When a calamity strikes collectively on the community as
a whole or a sizeable number of the followers are involved,
then, all the followers all over the world under go this
ceremony in their respective Jamatkhanas at the same time.
(1) Any follower of Agakhan, to get relief from the stricken
calamity or serious difficulty, approaches the Mukhi of the
concerned Jamatkhana. Mukhi after considering the gravity of
the situation, and the status of the person concerned,
determines an amount to be tendered in cash for the services
of Satada which is required to be paid in advance. Mukhi also
determines the type of sweets known as Juro / Sukrit which
is supposed to be distributed daily to each and every person
present at the ceremony.
Ceremony of this SATADA is performed daily in three stages :-
(i) Ginan and Giriyazari
(ii) Tasbih and Du'a.
(iii) A'abe Shifa and distribution of sweets.
Stage (i) :- Both the ladies and men folk collect in the
Jamatkhana and recite in chorus the Cult Rhymes known as
Ginan, the particular on to be sung in chorus at this occasion
is known as VENTI and beseech the Agakhan collectively to
bestow the required relief, previously ten incarnation of Hindu
gods were also invoked and Rhymes known as Das-Awtar (ten
Incarnations) were also sung in chorus.
(Stage (ii) :- Tasbih is recited aloud by the Mukhi and
converted into Du'a. As per Agakhani Cult practices Du'a is
never addressed to Allah but always and without exception
this Du'a is addressed to Imam Agakhan. The doctrinal
reasons are:-
(a) Imam the Agakhan is incarnated god in the form of bones
and flesh of Agakhan and
(b) Imam Agakhan is bearer or holder of Noor-e-Elahie. As this
Noor-e-Elahie is ingrained and innate into the body and flesh
of Agakhan his status automatically is identical to Allah.
Stage (iii) :- There after every follower present, on payment of
cash, according to the status in the community, gets a small
crucible of A'ab-e-Shifa that one drinks in one breath. In the
end the sweets are distributed, as an exception to the general
rule these distribution of sweets is not taxed.
Examples :-
(a) Mr. Ashiq Ali the late President of the Agakhan Federal
Council. (the highest organisation of Agakhan at national
level), was abducted and no trace or trail was available, this
ceremony took place repeatedly in all the Jamatkhanas,
Nation wide in Pakistan.
(b) When Agakhan-III the 48 th. Imam was in his death bed,
all the followers, world wide entered upon this ceremony. It is
fascinating to learn, how the then Imam Agakhan-III was
invoked on his own death bed for his own recovery. The Du'a
was :- "O Imam-i Hazir please cure your self by your own
spiritual power.
Note:- Futility of this ceremony is evident out of the fact that
in both these cases the calamity culminated into death.
Money paid by the family and the followers in Pakistan in
example (a) and the followers world over swelled the coffers of
the Agakhan.

M I S C E L L A N E O U S

M A J L E E S / M A J A L E E S.

MAJLEES / MAJALEES :- Periodical congregations of males
or females or combined for certain Cult Practices is called
Majlees, plural Majalees. This is very specific and of Cardinal
Importance to the Shi'a Imami Ismaili AgaKhani Cult, where at
certain Batini / Secret doctrinal teachings specific to this Cult
are preached / concocted by the Missionaries of the Aga
Khan's Mission Department, in these congregations / Majalees
There are more than twenty five types of Majalees, but it is a
striking fact that there is not a single Majlees regarding the
episode of Karbala or the Shahadat of Hazrat Hussain.

COMMON FACTORS IN THESE MAJALEES :-

(i) Most of these Majalees are monthly in Periodicity.
(ii) Monthly fees are variable according to the category of
members attending or any special importance is attached to
the particular Majlees.
(iii) Monthly fees are levied meticulously.
(iv) All the collection of fees and other services as detailed in
this schedule, go directly into the coffers of the Agakhan as
his private and personal property.
(v) Doctrinal Cult teaching and preaching is imparted and
concocted by the Missionaries attached to the Mission
Department of Agakhan.
(vi) The Choicest Blessings of the Imam Agakhan are always
there.

KANGWO = BAIYAT

Kangwo / Baiyat :- Kangwo means Baiyat. Every Follower
must be compulsorily in the Baiyat of Imam Agakhan. Every
Imam when he is bestowed with Imamat, whole of the
Community has to renew the Baiyat, without any exception.
This tradition is so strict that when the present Agakhan-IV
became Imam, his father Prince Ali Khan had to undertake
this Baiyat in other words the son became Spiritual Father of
his own Father.!?!?! This Tradition is equally applicable to
Ladies, Children, New-borns along with the men folk. Fees for
this Kangwa is fixed by the Imam Agakhan, which is required
to be deposited in advance and it is non-refundable. When
whole of the community world over tenders these money,
what a grand wind fall just in the start.?!?

DAST - BOSHI

Dast-Boshi :- Literally means to kiss the hand. Fees / Price
according to the status of the person intending to proceed
with this ceremony. On the arrival of the Agakhan practically
every follower pays the pre-determined amount, which is
usually affordable by all. Due to hygienic reasons this
ceremony is hardly ever entered upon, in lieu of this Imam
Agakhan bargains with choicest blessings and the bequests the
spiritual sawab of the Dast-Boshi. A cheap bargain for the
followers, and the coffers of the Agakhan swell by millions.

S A R B A N D H I.

SARBANDHI :- Any follower of this Cult, who wants to prove
one's (i) utmost devotion to Imam Aga Khan, (ii) to prove one's
honesty while engaged in the honorary services in any
institution of Agakhan. (iii) to get relief from any
impeachment ordained by Aga khan or any officer of Aga
Khan's institution, one declares himself as SARBANDHI. Under
this declaration one has to surrender all his property, movable
or immovable, tangible or intangible to the Chief / Mukhi of
the concerned Jamat Khana. The apparels worn on the body
are also valued and the payment of which is to be tendered
from the very first income earned by him / her. All these
properties go directly to Aga Khan and coffers of Aga Khan are
further swelled.

B U K K U S.

BUKKUS :- All the properties movable or immovable, tangible,
intangible held by the follower of this Cult are considered as
the properties of Imam Agakhan and the concerned followers
are just the trustees. This is also true for one's Life, Body and
Soul. In adverse circumstances, this right can be exercised by
the Aga Khan. It was last exercised by Agakhan-I at the time of
his refuge into Sindh when he was hounded out from Iran. He
compulsorily levied twenty percent of all the properties of the
followers.

C O N C L U S I O N .

Schedule -1
In the preceding pages only a very brief survey of Agakhan's
Cult Income is provided, detailed survey is out of place in the
memorandum like this, consequently, this is not an
exhaustive survey. There are many other secret services. New
ideas are not rare and innovation in the services are common.
All these services of the Agakhani Cult, devised to generate
money income, have no parallel in the Quranic Injunctions,
Prophetic Guidance, nor in any of the recognised Fiqah of
Islam, nor in Islamic History spread over more than fourteen
centuries, therefore, one can easily conclude that all the Cult
Practices of the Agakhani Cult are alien to Islam and out of
pale of Islam. Practically all these Agakhani Cult Practices are
formulated to generate vast money income in illegal,
unauthorised, immoral, inhuman manner to meet the selfish
and greedy ends of a single person of very doubtful
credentials. Regarding his religious affinity, a person who is
claimed to be Allah in the human form by virtue of the so
called fact that he is the bearer of Noor-e-Elahie and
Noor-e-Risalat by his followers and this fact has never been
disclaimed by Imam Agakhan.
It is astonishing to learn that whole of this evil machination
is very efficiently run without any accessible accounts and
totally without any documentation. But these are the facts
and are verifiable on the evening of the New-Moon day in each
and every Jamatkhana. The New-Moon day called Chand-Rat
is previously announced by the governing authority and it is
of no importance whether the New-Moon appears or not. No
uncertainty is allowed to creep into and as result the required
flow of income is guarantied.
The income generated is estimated at about 200 to 250
Millions per month. Astonishing fact is that all this huge
income escapes taxation, though this income is taxable
according to the provisions of Income Tax and Wealth Tax
Laws, Rules, Regulations applicable to all the assesses in
Pakistan, and this person with dubious and doubtful
Nationality and Character, by hook or by crook gets his taxes
exempted in direct contravention of Legal Provisions by way
of under hand tricks and treachery and utter
mis-representation.
All the followers of the Agakhan are also culprits of their
criminal activities of Tax Evasion e.g. The followers paying
these Crores of Rupees are nevershown as the income on their
Income Tax Returns nor any exemption ever claimed

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#147

Unread post by Muslim First » Wed Jun 04, 2008 5:57 pm

From: http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... 8b5cc039d8

shamsu
Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:37 am Post subject: Its just a movie


One of the name our Imam is also called is "Isa-e-zaman" meaning jesus of the time.

The Bible states in the begining there was a word. The word was with God, the word was God.

Our Ginans say "Aad thaki ek sun nipaya, sun mathi shabd nipaya" meaning from aad (before time) nothingness came into being and from that nothingness came a word.

What most christians dont know is what that word was. As Ismailies we are the only ones who are given the Ismae-Azam (Supreme word) by our Imam.

Most of the world is busy worshipping dead people or their graves. Ismailies are the only ones who are blessed with a continuous shower of blessings from the Source of all existance, through time, for centuries.
----
-----

One time Imam SMS declared in a conference of Islamic scholars that he was "Khalifatullah and Khalifatul Rasulillah" not one person objected to that declaration.

And this:
jasmine

Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:27 am


Am I correct in understanding that ismailis dont have to read Quran because we have Boltu Quran which is Mowla Bapa and he guides us accordingly. Correct me if I am wrong.

.

Danish
Posts: 1106
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#148

Unread post by Danish » Wed Jun 04, 2008 6:12 pm

Speaking of khalifatullah or rasoolallah or nabiullah:

"EVERYONE IS A PROPHET/MESSENGER UNTO THEMSELVES".

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#149

Unread post by Muslim First » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:18 pm

This will be gone soon from Ismaili.net

THE DEGREES OF HAZAR IMAM.
ShamsC
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
Posts: 1
Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:57 am Post subject: THE DEGREES OF HAZAR IMAM.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Below is the most current degree:----

"LEFT Photo: 2008, June 5: Prince Karim Aga Khan receives an Honorary Doctor of Laws degree from Harvard University at commencement ceremonies June 5, 2008, in Cambridge, Massachusetts. J.K. Rowling, who wrote the popular Harry Potter books, was the commencement speaker. (Photo by Robert Spencer/Getty Images).

Now let me show you how these degrees help in real life with real issues:--

BOOK WRITTEN WITH THESE DEGREES:

NEW BOOK: 2008, May: Douglas & McIntyre - Where Hope Takes Root: Democracy and Pluralism in an Interdependent World - By: His Highness The Aga Khan. In Where Hope Takes Root, a collection of talks given over the past six years, the Aga Khan sets out the principles that inform his vision of peaceful, productive societies. He returns again and again to the three cornerstones upon which his many years of work in the developing world are based: democracy, pluralism and civil society. Democracy, always fragile, must be nurtured in practical and flexible ways, he says. Pluralism must be embraced in both fact and spirit. And engaged civil society, which the Aga Khan defines broadly as including doctors’ and journalists’ associations, women’s groups, social movements and village organizations, must be actively supported in countries around the globe. [144 pages, expected in May 2008]

LET'S SEE IF ALL THESE DEGREES WORTH ANYTHING:--

The above book by Karim confirms my belief that paganism and barbarism of ancient world are comming back upon us. The dark ages of Greek and Rome are reviving and man are trying to live in terms of pagan philosophy and pagan ideas.

Pluralism says that every belief out there in the world is equally legitimate and has truth to it and we should just blindly embrace it even though an individual's belief is in cow or monkey or crocodile or any pagan god. To define pluralism in a very simplistic way I would use Rodney King phrase "CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG?"

In ancient of days when people were ignornat, they just believed in anything they chose to and everything was just A-OK to them. One day you could be worshiping cow or next day in the mosque or next day you could be in the temple or next day you could be on the top of the mountain worshiping SUN gOD. !! Even the "MUD" god was ok for them. And this is what Karim is promoting in this age.!!

This shows Karim's (my ex-god's) ignorance of Biblical Christianity.

Jesus in John 14:6 says:

"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

In the above verse Lord Jesus Christ makes exclusive claim of one and only God. Jesus,unlike Karim, does not want to appease the entire world and their pagan gods. The defInite article "THE" in the above verse means "the one and the only way... the one and only truth..... the one and only life ". This means that there is no other way. Just like "THE PLANET EARTH" (one and only planet earth). There is not smorgs-abord/buffet of Gods out there that you can pick and choose. Jesus is the only way to salvation.

The transcendentalists, the newagers, the scientologists,the hindus, the muslims,the jews, the buddhists, the mooneys, the Jehova's Witnesses, the Mormans, the humanists and ismailis, no matter whatever brand name they want to put on their chest, but they will not go to heavan without the salvation of Lord Jesus Christ. They will NOT go to heavan by their good intention, by their good obedience, by their sacrificial animals, by their devotions, by their good deeds, by their great abilities, by exercising of their gifts, or by chanting, like pagans do, upon thier bol (secrect word) in zahir- batin(humpty- dumpty) pagan rituals.

Karim have no idea that TRUTH is not stablished by appeasing and bending down in front of all the pagan gods in the world. Or bringing all the beliefs of the world in to harmoney. Or by tolerating for each other's beliefs. Truth is not democratic or manufactured by respecting each others pagan beliefs.

Your karim god should be told that True and Living God is not democratic. HE is a MONARCH. HE IS KING OF KINGS. Lord Jesus Christ did not give his revelation by democratic process. HE was the absolute and only authority when HE revealed HIMSELF and inspired prophets to bring HIS messages to the world. HE did not get prophets openions before HE inspired them with HIS revelations. HE did not appease prophets. In fact prophets had no choice but to deliver HIS message to us.

For Karim to promote pluralism shows that he may be, like his uncle Saddruddin, a hidden athiest. Or may be a communist becassue most of the promoters of pluralism are hidden communitsts.

Instead of Karim trying to be a "GOOD BOY" with all the cultists faith of the world, he should bow down in front of Lord Jesus Christ and be a good boy with HIM.

While I am typing this post, this thought kept running in my head :---

"I ONCE BELIEVE THIS SPIRITUAL MIDGET( KARIM ) AS MY GOD. MY DAD, MOM, BROTHERS DIED BELIVING THIS SPIRITUALLY DEAD MAN AS GOD AND NOW AT THIS MOMENT THEY ARE BURNING IN LAKE OF FIRE IN HELL AND SCREAMING WITH EXCRUCIATING PAIN WHICH WILL HAVE NO END"

SO ALL THESE DEGREES ARE AVAILABLE TO ANYONE WHO HAS BIG MONEY TO DONATE. IF I WAS A BIG DRUG DEALER AND DONATED BIG MONEY TO COMSE CRACKER JACK COLLEGE OR UNIVERSITY, I MAY GET THE DEGREE.

Harvard University, in my calculated openion, is the university where the most athiests and communists are manufactured.

REMEMBER: JESUS CHANGES HEARTS AND NOT MY POST.

Muslim First
Posts: 6893
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2001 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili mazhab

#150

Unread post by Muslim First » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:19 pm

Sorry:

Forgot the link

THE DEGREES OF HAZAR IMAM.
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... b76230cd2d