How about we all discuss something more constructive for a change, like protesting over the ill treatment and desecration of Holy Quran at Guantanamo.
I saw many posts by so-called "progessive" bohras within hours of inaugration of Saifee Hospital, but even a day after the confirmation from the US govt no one has come forward to protest this ghastly act. This just shows how hypocritical some of the people here are.
I will be the first "REALLY" progressive Bohra to say that the US Govt should treat the findings with greatest importance and deal with the matter with urgency. I state my deep anguish and agony regarding what has happened in Guantanamo.
May Kafirs burn in the deepest pit of HELL and may our Beloved Aqa Mola (T.U.S) live a long happy life ta-qayamat. AMEEN !!!
MOULA MUBARAK MUBARAK MUBARAK !!!!
Desecration of Quran
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Huzefa Asgerali
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:01 am
Re: Desecration of Quran
Dai Ke Dushmano gorse tum suno
Rah sidhi chalo akla se kamlo
AAj tak asa rehber na tum lasake
Ek muddat Hue dhunte dhunte.
Saifee Hospital has been inauguratted by prime minister of INDIA and Many personalities from all over the world arrived and praised the Good work of Dr.Sayyad na Sahab.
MOULA MUBARAK MUBARAK MUBARAK............
Rah sidhi chalo akla se kamlo
AAj tak asa rehber na tum lasake
Ek muddat Hue dhunte dhunte.
Saifee Hospital has been inauguratted by prime minister of INDIA and Many personalities from all over the world arrived and praised the Good work of Dr.Sayyad na Sahab.
MOULA MUBARAK MUBARAK MUBARAK............
Re: Desecration of Quran
Where is Kothari People on this topic. How come nobody from Kothar has come out and condemned USA I know why because they paid US $ 250,000 to George Bush for his re election.
So before you blubber your big mouth defaming others ask yourself and your leaders to do the same
So before you blubber your big mouth defaming others ask yourself and your leaders to do the same
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Average Bohra
- Posts: 924
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:01 am
Re: Desecration of Quran
Before everyone jumps on the bandwagon and gets carried away with this desecration hype, look inward for a moment. You are being played like sheep yet again.
You all ignore the fact that in the latest Trafficking in Persons Report the Tier 3 countries (those that do not enforce even minimal standards) was dominated by Islamic countries including Saudi Arabia, Kuwait & Qatar. Muslim babies (mostly girls) are being imported from poor Asian countries and are being used as sex slaves, camel jockeys and forced labor in the Arab world.
These same countries routinely torture its own prisoners, and don't allow basic political and human freedoms, and none are democracies.
So before you get your panties tied up in a knot over Quran desecration, consider the fact that who gave these prisoners Quran, Halal food and directions on how to handle them with respect in the first place ? When some abuses are found they are investigated and prosecuted.
Still worried about desecration? Just pray that your butts never get thrown into a jail in an Islamic country, as you will then think of Gitmo as Hog Heaven.
You all ignore the fact that in the latest Trafficking in Persons Report the Tier 3 countries (those that do not enforce even minimal standards) was dominated by Islamic countries including Saudi Arabia, Kuwait & Qatar. Muslim babies (mostly girls) are being imported from poor Asian countries and are being used as sex slaves, camel jockeys and forced labor in the Arab world.
These same countries routinely torture its own prisoners, and don't allow basic political and human freedoms, and none are democracies.
So before you get your panties tied up in a knot over Quran desecration, consider the fact that who gave these prisoners Quran, Halal food and directions on how to handle them with respect in the first place ? When some abuses are found they are investigated and prosecuted.
Still worried about desecration? Just pray that your butts never get thrown into a jail in an Islamic country, as you will then think of Gitmo as Hog Heaven.
Re: Desecration of Quran
We should also not ignore the fact that the human trafficking report was published by the USA, and that too immediately after the report published by the Amnesty international about Gitmo.
The same people who told us that Saddam could destroy us in 45 minutes and that he had 80 million gazillion tonnes of biological weapons hidden in his underpants, the pictures of which we saw recently.
The same people who told us that Saddam could destroy us in 45 minutes and that he had 80 million gazillion tonnes of biological weapons hidden in his underpants, the pictures of which we saw recently.
Re: Desecration of Quran
On the other hand I do believe that countries like Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Qatar need new leadership that will not dance to American tunes. If the rulers of these countries hadn't been American whores in the first place, Muslims wouldn't have been suffering the humiliation that they are these days.
But Iraq gives me hope. The ordinary Muslim has proved too much for the oppressors. Hopefully this jihad will spread to other Muslim nations and the oppressive rulers will be thrown out soon.
But Iraq gives me hope. The ordinary Muslim has proved too much for the oppressors. Hopefully this jihad will spread to other Muslim nations and the oppressive rulers will be thrown out soon.
Re: Desecration of Quran
Here's another fact that has come to my attention. One needs to be a criminal to land up in a jail in an Islamic country, however you do not need to be a criminal to land up in Gitmo.
And if you do not believe me, you can do your own research.
And if you do not believe me, you can do your own research.
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Average Bohra
- Posts: 924
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:01 am
Re: Desecration of Quran
If Islamic countries had a free press, or a free anything, maybe their reports could counter other reports. Hell if Islamic countries had a free anything , you guys would be better off wouldn't you ? Anajmi for one could earn an honest living where he is from, rather than in a country he despises.
It is also ironic that Anajmi doesn’t dispute the facts, but rather that it was published by the US. Perhaps, he is waiting for Saudi Arabia to publish such a report. It may be a long wait my friend.
If the rulers of these countries hadn't been American whores in the first place. You make my point very well, thank you. Why aren’t the Swedish, Indians, Brazilians, and the French American whores ? Cause they have one thing in common (they are not Islamic). Muslims are easy targets, very vulnerable, and eternal victims and whose fault is that ? Even you Anajmi can figure that one out.
Ask the Kurds and Iranians (and Iraqis) what Saddam can do, but then again that won’t give you a hard on since Muslim-on-Muslim violence is accepted, common and ignored by Muslims.
Join the herd and concentrate on the "desecration" story; your masters want you to.
It is also ironic that Anajmi doesn’t dispute the facts, but rather that it was published by the US. Perhaps, he is waiting for Saudi Arabia to publish such a report. It may be a long wait my friend.
If the rulers of these countries hadn't been American whores in the first place. You make my point very well, thank you. Why aren’t the Swedish, Indians, Brazilians, and the French American whores ? Cause they have one thing in common (they are not Islamic). Muslims are easy targets, very vulnerable, and eternal victims and whose fault is that ? Even you Anajmi can figure that one out.
Ask the Kurds and Iranians (and Iraqis) what Saddam can do, but then again that won’t give you a hard on since Muslim-on-Muslim violence is accepted, common and ignored by Muslims.
Join the herd and concentrate on the "desecration" story; your masters want you to.
Re: Desecration of Quran
You got that right.If Islamic countries had a free press, or a free anything, maybe their reports could counter other reports. Hell if Islamic countries had a free anything , you guys would be better off wouldn't you ? Anajmi for one could earn an honest living where he is from, rather than in a country he despises.
You got that one wrong my friend. The fact that it was published by the US is the biggest dispute against the "facts".It is also ironic that Anajmi doesn’t dispute the facts, but rather that it was published by the US.
Got that one wrong too my friend. Kuwait is an American whore because America launched it's attacks from Kuwaiti soil. Qatar is an American whore because America moved it's biggest military base from Saudi to Qatar and which assisted in the killings of innocent muslims. Saudi Arabia is an American whore because we saw its leader kissing Bush a couple of weeks back.If the rulers of these countries hadn't been American whores in the first place. You make my point very well, thank you. Why aren’t the Swedish, Indians, Brazilians, and the French American whores ? Cause they have one thing in common (they are not Islamic).
As far as the Swedish, French, Brazilians and Indians are concerned, well, I am sure you should be able to figure it out now or do I still need to educate you?
Well, what Saddam did, he was able to do as long as he was an American whore. The day he refused to play ball, look what happened. Even today if given a choice between the Americans and Saddam, 98% Iraqis (forget about anajmi) choose Saddam. Go figure.Ask the Kurds and Iranians (and Iraqis) what Saddam can do, but then again that won’t give you a hard on since Muslim-on-Muslim violence is accepted, common and ignored by Muslims.
Huh!! Moron!!Join the herd and concentrate on the "desecration" story; your masters want you to.
Re: Desecration of Quran
Have to clarify something. I do not despise America. I have been able to earn an honest living over here and have been able to provide for my family. I just despise some Americans, most of them associated with the current ruling Administration and some others!! Of course I even despise some Muslims like the ruling whores of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Qatar.
Re: Desecration of Quran
The good thing about America is that we can hope for the situation to improve in a few years, but considering the kind of leaders that America has produced in the last couple of decades that seems unlikely.
However, the problem with the muslim countries is that there will need to be a revolution, and that will involve bloodshed. Of course the muslim ummah will need to overthrow the ruling elite, however to do so it will need to take on the current superpower cause it is in the interest of the current superpower to keep the evil muslim rulers in place.
However, the problem with the muslim countries is that there will need to be a revolution, and that will involve bloodshed. Of course the muslim ummah will need to overthrow the ruling elite, however to do so it will need to take on the current superpower cause it is in the interest of the current superpower to keep the evil muslim rulers in place.
Re: Desecration of Quran
Anajmi and Average Bohra,
I like the discussion b/w you two and i have been following this on many topics.
Here both of you are right and have valid points and I fully agree with you Two.
In general Americans are good and simple, their govts notably Bush era has been worse. The life in US is good and there is rule of law and reason. On the other hand the US govt does what it has to continue RULING the WORLD. It has its own agenda and interests and for that they will do everything and anything. So they are Right in a way.
About Muslim countries, right, they are all whores. Islam today provides best laws and ideas for human beings but we have been robbed by these whores ruling is everywhere in Islamic Countries. We need Revolution, not from outside, but from inside.
I like the discussion b/w you two and i have been following this on many topics.
Here both of you are right and have valid points and I fully agree with you Two.
In general Americans are good and simple, their govts notably Bush era has been worse. The life in US is good and there is rule of law and reason. On the other hand the US govt does what it has to continue RULING the WORLD. It has its own agenda and interests and for that they will do everything and anything. So they are Right in a way.
About Muslim countries, right, they are all whores. Islam today provides best laws and ideas for human beings but we have been robbed by these whores ruling is everywhere in Islamic Countries. We need Revolution, not from outside, but from inside.
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Average Bohra
- Posts: 924
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:01 am
Re: Desecration of Quran
JC,
I accept your criticism of the US Foreign policy in that it will do anything to serve US interests. My point has always been that this is not unique to the US or the West, and it is idealistic to think that any country wold not act in its self interests, often at the expense of others. The Ottomans, Europeans and even the Arab states have dominated, or currently dominate and influence who they can.
I accept your criticism of the US Foreign policy in that it will do anything to serve US interests. My point has always been that this is not unique to the US or the West, and it is idealistic to think that any country wold not act in its self interests, often at the expense of others. The Ottomans, Europeans and even the Arab states have dominated, or currently dominate and influence who they can.
Re: Desecration of Quran
I use to get tensed a lot when I use to hear the things like one happened in Guantanamo.
But now when I see people fighting against mistreatment of Quran, I feel that these protesters are doing so only because they are carried away by their emotions. There is no true substance in it. People like to blame others for the difficulties in their life. Every human being has energy that needs to be released and for some people energy is released by protesting.
What is the need to protest so much for just a book of Quran. If it is Gods book then let God protect it. Why are we trying to act superior then god?
Why are these protesters not fighting for those people who are suffering with after math of war? These protesters should divert their energy in doing some constructive work, like helping people in need, building hospitals & schools, helping abused and under privileged people.
Who cares how they are treating Quran, at last Quran they are abusing is just a paper copy of Allah’s word made my human. No one can mistreat God’s word. If they are mishandling one paper copy, we can print many more.
Why not invest our time and energy in helping those people suffering from mental and physical diseases. If we loose a life we won’t be able to print them in printing press. All those guys who are getting carried away because some one mishandled the paper book should open one of the copies they have in their home and read it and try to understand the lesson it teaches of forgiveness, generosity and help.
God’s words don’t need protection, God’s words need action.
But now when I see people fighting against mistreatment of Quran, I feel that these protesters are doing so only because they are carried away by their emotions. There is no true substance in it. People like to blame others for the difficulties in their life. Every human being has energy that needs to be released and for some people energy is released by protesting.
What is the need to protest so much for just a book of Quran. If it is Gods book then let God protect it. Why are we trying to act superior then god?
Why are these protesters not fighting for those people who are suffering with after math of war? These protesters should divert their energy in doing some constructive work, like helping people in need, building hospitals & schools, helping abused and under privileged people.
Who cares how they are treating Quran, at last Quran they are abusing is just a paper copy of Allah’s word made my human. No one can mistreat God’s word. If they are mishandling one paper copy, we can print many more.
Why not invest our time and energy in helping those people suffering from mental and physical diseases. If we loose a life we won’t be able to print them in printing press. All those guys who are getting carried away because some one mishandled the paper book should open one of the copies they have in their home and read it and try to understand the lesson it teaches of forgiveness, generosity and help.
God’s words don’t need protection, God’s words need action.
Re: Desecration of Quran
Good one khuzema...This is another "petty concern" ... worrying over mistreatment of a physical hard copy of Quran without realising that the spirit of Quran cannot be "desecrated" by people who do not believe in it...ironically, the muslim world is too much stuck into petty "symbolism" which is not much different from the idol worship that islam condemns......they have a perpetual "minority insecurity complex" and this touchiness makes them a very easy target to offend and manipulate......One Arial Sharon purposely walks on the wrong side of the mosque complex and an entire Intefada is launched...next day this chap comes to power because everything happened as he planned...know what I am saying....muslims have let their religion become their weakness instead of strength.
...they have to know the difference between letter and spirit...a physical copy of Quran is as easy to produce as any other book and so is always prone to fall into "wrong hands" and get "desecrated"...what is difficult is to imbibe the essence of the religion which no one can desecrate without your own will.
...they have to know the difference between letter and spirit...a physical copy of Quran is as easy to produce as any other book and so is always prone to fall into "wrong hands" and get "desecrated"...what is difficult is to imbibe the essence of the religion which no one can desecrate without your own will.
Re: Desecration of Quran
Well, I have to agree with what you guys have said.
Here is what we should do though. Throw a copy of the bible down the toilet. I am willing to bet my last dollar that the reaction will be nowhere close to what happened with the quran. Is that because the bible believeres have imbibed the essence of the religion which no one can desecrate without their own free will? r is it because they think that it is just a book and that no one can mistreat God's word? or is it because they don't give a freaking damn?
Here is what we should do though. Throw a copy of the bible down the toilet. I am willing to bet my last dollar that the reaction will be nowhere close to what happened with the quran. Is that because the bible believeres have imbibed the essence of the religion which no one can desecrate without their own free will? r is it because they think that it is just a book and that no one can mistreat God's word? or is it because they don't give a freaking damn?
Re: Desecration of Quran
ANY OF THE THREE....what is important is that no one can expect to get a socio political benefit by throwing a Bible down a toilet and so we dont hear instances of Bible "desecration".....Bible is not the soft underbelly of christians which any tom or dick can kick just for the pleasure of watching people pelting stones on the street.Is that because the bible believeres have imbibed the essence of the religion which no one can desecrate without their own free will? r is it because they think that it is just a book and that no one can mistreat God's word? or is it because they don't give a freaking damn?
Re: Desecration of Quran
That is the difference between a true muslim and a legal muslim as defined by the great alim Maulana Abu Ala Maududi.
The muslims for whom it does not matter are legal muslims, and those for whom it does matter are true muslims.
I have chosen which one I want to be, I guess you have too!!
The muslims for whom it does not matter are legal muslims, and those for whom it does matter are true muslims.
I have chosen which one I want to be, I guess you have too!!
Re: Desecration of Quran
There is a hadith of the prophet (saw) where he said that a muslim choose to fight oppression in three different ways.
1 - Think against it.
2 - Speak against it.
3 - Act against it.
Those who think against it are the one with the weakest faith. Now imagine what are those that don't even want to think against it cause it depresses them!!
1 - Think against it.
2 - Speak against it.
3 - Act against it.
Those who think against it are the one with the weakest faith. Now imagine what are those that don't even want to think against it cause it depresses them!!
Re: Desecration of Quran
Dont you "think" that one should really try to figure out what is "oppression" in the first place? I would like to know how does the "great alim" Maulana Abu Ala Maududi or the prophet defined oppression?
I see that in the other thread you are getting sarcastic about the progressive cause and you said that you have no love lost for the dai and kothar. So how in your view these two "greats" (the alim and the prophet)would have compared the following two situations:
1.mishandling an easily reproducable hard copy of quran somewhere by someone.
2.forcing a million people to do sajda in front of the dai and extorting unjustified money from the followers.
Now suppose that the "desecration" thing is established as oppression by rule number "x" on page number "y" of Quran, what would be a more effective way to fight this "oppression" -
1.propogating your thoughts through media (like internet) and trying to get it through to the people who can make a difference.
2. pelting stones on street and burning tyres ...where most of the damage is done to the property of the "believers" while the "oppressors" go around safe in their armoured vehicles.
I see that in the other thread you are getting sarcastic about the progressive cause and you said that you have no love lost for the dai and kothar. So how in your view these two "greats" (the alim and the prophet)would have compared the following two situations:
1.mishandling an easily reproducable hard copy of quran somewhere by someone.
2.forcing a million people to do sajda in front of the dai and extorting unjustified money from the followers.
Now suppose that the "desecration" thing is established as oppression by rule number "x" on page number "y" of Quran, what would be a more effective way to fight this "oppression" -
1.propogating your thoughts through media (like internet) and trying to get it through to the people who can make a difference.
2. pelting stones on street and burning tyres ...where most of the damage is done to the property of the "believers" while the "oppressors" go around safe in their armoured vehicles.
Re: Desecration of Quran
Well, sometimes the muslim do get carried away. But then I have to figure out which one was more effective? Do you know? Or would that be a petty concern for you?
And are armoured vehicles really safe? At least the military doesn't think so.
And are armoured vehicles really safe? At least the military doesn't think so.
Re: Desecration of Quran
the sooner the "blind followers" figure it out , better for themWell, sometimes the muslim do get carried away. But then I have to figure out which one was more effective
How safe is the moron outside that vehicle fighting for nothing? A look into the death rates on both the sides may give you an idea.And are armoured vehicles really safe?
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Average Bohra
- Posts: 924
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:01 am
Re: Desecration of Quran
Great article...
Re: Desecration of Quran
Well, at least the moron outside won't be burning in hell. As far as the death rates are concerned, well Allah is most merciful, for every 50 Iraqis that he is sending to heaven, only one oppressor is being sent to hell.How safe is the moron outside that vehicle fighting for nothing? A look into the death rates on both the sides may give you an idea.
As far as the "great article" is concerned, no different than any shit that you morons have posted, is it?
Re: Desecration of Quran
he has already had enuf of hell ever since he was brought to earth as the 20th child of his moronic father who didnt care to purchase a condom while screwing his sister.Well, at least the moron outside won't be burning in hell
Re: Desecration of Quran
Guys,
We always get carried away.
I for one do not agree on True Muslim, Legal Muslim, Shia, Sunni etc. To me Muslims are Muslims and to me we should move towards the end where relgion is personal affair of a human being. I want to respect all religions and all followers. Its any one's choice.
AB,
Yes, everybody has the right to defend its interests. So does US. West and so does others. Even dictators defend their interests so we cannot blame them - yes, if a dictator is defending his interests and ie we do not like that, then we should wake up and fight against that. Same is true for people who want to fight USA. As I said, I for one would not like people fighting over religion. The current WARS are NOT for religion, so lets leave it.
Taher,
I agree. The incident was not that we should start burning our own property. We should condemn and raise our voices agaisnt it. This has hurt millions so they have a right to SPEAK up, but not the things we have witnessed.
Anajmi,
Why would one do the same to Bible? and If this is being done, we as Muslims should also object. Bible is holy book (though mu ideas on holy books are little but different), and even if Muslims believe that true bible doesnot exist today, if something bad happens or is being done to bible, muslims should also speak of their displeasure.
We must not forget that sentiment against Iraq and Afghanistan war is more visible and concrete in West then in Muslim countries. We have agreed that our leaders are whores. But man we have to share some blame - why do not we ACT (and you said this earlier) - we THINK it is wrong, we do seldon SPEAK, so lets SPEAK louldy and ACT!!
Muslims have bigger problems to address then this one.
We always get carried away.
I for one do not agree on True Muslim, Legal Muslim, Shia, Sunni etc. To me Muslims are Muslims and to me we should move towards the end where relgion is personal affair of a human being. I want to respect all religions and all followers. Its any one's choice.
AB,
Yes, everybody has the right to defend its interests. So does US. West and so does others. Even dictators defend their interests so we cannot blame them - yes, if a dictator is defending his interests and ie we do not like that, then we should wake up and fight against that. Same is true for people who want to fight USA. As I said, I for one would not like people fighting over religion. The current WARS are NOT for religion, so lets leave it.
Taher,
I agree. The incident was not that we should start burning our own property. We should condemn and raise our voices agaisnt it. This has hurt millions so they have a right to SPEAK up, but not the things we have witnessed.
Anajmi,
Why would one do the same to Bible? and If this is being done, we as Muslims should also object. Bible is holy book (though mu ideas on holy books are little but different), and even if Muslims believe that true bible doesnot exist today, if something bad happens or is being done to bible, muslims should also speak of their displeasure.
We must not forget that sentiment against Iraq and Afghanistan war is more visible and concrete in West then in Muslim countries. We have agreed that our leaders are whores. But man we have to share some blame - why do not we ACT (and you said this earlier) - we THINK it is wrong, we do seldon SPEAK, so lets SPEAK louldy and ACT!!
Muslims have bigger problems to address then this one.
Re: Desecration of Quran
You seem to know quite a bit about that don't you? Were you the 19th or the 21st?he has already had enuf of hell ever since he was brought to earth as the 20th child of his moronic father who didnt care to purchase a condom while screwing his sister.
Re: Desecration of Quran
who cares!!.... all I know is that we (50 in all) gotta show the corpse of an "opressor" to claim our reserved seats in "heaven"....cant stand this hell anymore ...
PS: liked the late but sharp retort...
PS: liked the late but sharp retort...
Re: Desecration of Quran
Well, the next one would've been even better, but you don't seem to be making a point anymore.