Forum Rules

Given modern distractions, the need to understand Islam better has never been more urgent. Through this forum we can share ideas and hopefully promote the true spirit of Islam which calls for peace, justice, tolerance, inclusiveness and diversity.
turbocanuck
Posts: 1531
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#91

Unread post by turbocanuck » Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:07 pm

anajmi wrote:
i recommend others to ignore you, not me
Spoken like a true Ismaili. Do what I say and not what I do.
You got it........i stand on guard....... :mrgreen: but then again,some ismailis may decide to take you on, thats the beauty of intellect.......without the fear of a slit throat...... :wink:

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#92

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:08 pm

So you are preventing the dumb Ismailis from debating with me. I see. Can you list the dumb Ismailis? So I won't waste my time with them. I was trying to talk to znan when you butted in. So I guess znan is dumb. How about jawanmardan? Is he dumb too?

znan,

Can't have a discussion with you unless you can show that you have knowledge about the final revealed ayahs of the quran. Tell me when you find out and then I might be interested in talking to you.

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#93

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:22 pm

znan,

One other thing. Looks like Turbo agrees with me now. You do not have the intellect to take me on. So let me know when you find the final reveal ayahs of the quran. Till then, take some classes.

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#94

Unread post by znanwalla » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:56 pm

Oh Yeah ! please don't make me laugh so hysterically ....frankly I suggest that you do some proper research and learn about our Islamic history and the Quran and the ahadith and then come and talk to us....why waste everyone's time huh?...please go in peace !...zn

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Ismaili/Wahabi discussion

#95

Unread post by pardesi » Sat Nov 01, 2008 10:17 pm

Aarif wrote: Pardesi,
You still remember my one statement that you have been misqouting every time you write any post against me.
Brother Aarif,

That one statement made me suspicious of your beliefs. You had said that you were a Bohra and then you made that statement. I can paste the whole conversation here if you like. The bottom line is you said what you actually believed and I will always remind you about it.
However you have forgotten the hundreds of statements that I have written justifying my stance as far as Prophets and Imams are concerned.
I would really like to see where you actually did that. You have never really supported any Imams of any sect. If you have then show me those hundreds of statements you are talking about.
For people like you Islam is all about hazar Imam. It starts with him and ends with him. I am sure you will become my friend the day I start singing praises of your hazar Imam. Now that shows your level of understanding about Islam.
Hazar Imam is "Hazar" for those who believe in his Imamat. However, I have tried to make you understand our beliefs in Imamat but you refuse to engage. For us Islam begins with Allah and his Prophets continued to guide the believers and when the last of the Prophets left this world he appointed an Imam to continue the teaching and guidance. This "Hazar" Imam is from that same line of Imams that the Prophet left behind, unfortunately you guys failed to get with the program. If you have any doubts about my understanding of Islam which you hold so dear as your personal property why not engage in a topic of your choice and let others decide about my level of understanding of "your" Islam? Remember, I was brought up with mostly Memons of Karachi and not mostly Ismailis other than my family.
As far as leaving debates is concerned I have told you very clearly that if I stop replying to your idiotic posts you should immediately understand that I do not want to waste my time on you.
It is unfortunate that you feel that way. Our conversation is over as soon as I start asking you questions.... Why is that? You ask questions and I answer and then I ask questions and you answer. Isn't it the way it is supposed to work. But when I ask questions you feel that your authority to judge has been challenged and you get all annoyed. The reason why we have not arrived at any platform in the first place is that we have not gotten over the hump of trusting each other. Let me suggest a solution to that. I have accepted you the way you are. Can you do the same for us Ismailis as far as our beliefs are concerned. May be we can then go further into learning from each other. Clean heart and mind is a must for any discussion or learning. As I have told you earlier leave your baggage out when you enter. You will be surprised to learn how much you do not know about others!
For me you and your cohorts are equivalents of those blind syedna followers like Gulp and Jayanti. Now I do not expect any sensible debates with those blind syedna followers who keep doing Moula Moula all the times. You guys fall in the same category... To me you never made any sense because you never talked any sense...
Again, it is unfortunate you feel that way. I can not speak about your co-religionists (Gulf and Jayanti) or your Dai but me and my "cohorts" are trying to answer but you are not willing to hear because what we are saying is not what you want to hear, hence it is "rubbish and lies".
Here is a small qoute from a Meherally article. Can you logically debate and refute his argument in light of Islam???
The Ismailis are not instructed to offer the Islamic Salaah, observe Saum or perform Hajj. They have replaced Salaah with certain shirk-infested Dua'as (thrice a day). They are told that their Hajj is a personal "Glimpse" (Deedaar) of Karim Aga Khan.
I extended you the invitation to debate "logically" earlier. Define logic first and accept its preconditions. Like my other Ismaili friends said there is a lot of discussion done on this board on the subject of Salaat, Saum and Hajj. In the interest of not getting bogged down by repititive arguments read them up. Read Meherally's views on his site about Salaat (5 times vs 3 times), Ahadith collections and their authenticity, as I am sure you will base your arguments on those two sources. This will help you save your face. You have also brought articles from the internet and posted them here re the Ismailis and their past history but never did your homework as to what those articles were actually saying and therefore, when pointed out to you, never followed up to discuss them with us.

Any discussion has to have a starting point. If your contention is the Imamat and like Anajmi you want to discuss only my Imam then you will have to discuss my Imam and his activities in light of Imams and their activities of the past. This will take us back to "YOUR IMAMS", the Musta Alians. Willing to discuss "YOUR" Imams? For that you will have to prove you are a Bohra. And to discuss Musta Ali line of Imams we will have to go back in history and discuss previous Imams going as far back as Ali. Now you will argu about Ali's appointment so for that matter we will have to discuss the Prophet. This is what Znan was trying to tell you in a previous post. I believe that Prophet Mohammad would be the right starting point. And to start there we will have to look at what Quran is saying about all this and for that it is very important you know which Ayats were last revealed to the Prophet and in which context.

If you do not intend to continue debating with us then the least you could do is stay quiet for a while and let this topic rest. If you keep repeating your rhetoric we will be just going in circles.

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#96

Unread post by anajmi » Sat Nov 01, 2008 11:17 pm

pardesi,

I would like to have a discussion with you, but you might need to figure out your intellectual capabilities from Turbo who is your guard. Once he clears you, let me know, we can have another go.

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#97

Unread post by znanwalla » Sun Nov 02, 2008 3:51 am

Najmi,

I think brother Pardesi has made valid points and has analyzed it well...you don't seem to really have an answer and so the rhetoric.....brother Turbo is more sensible than you think he is and so I am beginning to doubt your judgment and capabailities Najmi.....like I have suggested to you, you need to go and get some education in the Islamic history - history of the Fatimid period (assuming you are a Bohra ) - the authentic ahadith and ofcourse the Quran where you seem to be terribly lacking....how ironical for you stake hugh claims and when challenged you haven't shown any qualitative discourse ability.....then you want people like JM to waste their time with you...even I respect JM's knowledge but you called him a "dumb" Ismaili...truly sad huh !

Why don't you tell us what is your personal wound that makes you so biased towards us? at least tell us so we can better understand your hatred towards us !.....otherwise go in peace and pursue your own belief and religion or are you not happy with your faith? ...I hope you realize that "gheebah" is a grave sin in islam ?......zn

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#98

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:37 am

znan,

I am not sure about pardesi's intellectual capabilities. Turbo is your guard. He will tell me if you are intellectually capable of taking me on or not. In your case, I am sure you are not since you haven't been able to produce the final revealed ayahs of the quran.

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#99

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:39 am

Why don't you tell us what is your personal wound that makes you so biased towards us? at least tell us so we can better understand your hatred towards us !.....
Have you been reading what you post? :wink:

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#100

Unread post by znanwalla » Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:22 pm

Hatred is an attribute of your cult ! not ours !You folks are the "Grand Illusion" of the power potentates who believe the world can be enslaved with YOUR Big Lie of inordinate self-serving peddling which is without any moral or civilized principle....and absolutely unislamic !....zn

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#101

Unread post by znanwalla » Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:40 pm

Admin should be cautioning you and not me ! You are the one who is trying to be abusive unduly ! go and do what you want ! just get lost !

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#102

Unread post by anajmi » Sun Nov 02, 2008 4:48 pm

I haven't abused anydody. I am just trying to have a discussion with a qualified Ismaili. You are not qualified since you haven't been able to produce the final revealed ayahs of the quran and turbo doesn't think you are intellectually capable to take me on.

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#103

Unread post by pardesi » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:43 pm

anajmi wrote:....I am just trying to have a discussion with a qualified Ismaili. You are not qualified since you haven't been able to produce the final revealed ayahs of the quran ...
An unqualified mullah deciding who is qualified and the basis of this decision is "not being able to produce the final ayats of Quran". That would disqualify you too An ajmi since you have failed in that regard also. I wonder what is so sensitive about those last revelations that you are dancing around the question? Don't tell me you do not know which ones they are. Everybody knows. You are acting like an idiotic fool because you know that by answering the question you will be jumpstarting a debate you can't win.

So just let it go Anajmi. I promise I will not rub it in your face like I did on "Wajeebat" thread a while ago. Remember, you hypocrite?

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#104

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:15 am

Time to close the thread. Ismailis acting like Ismailis again. :mrgreen:

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#105

Unread post by znanwalla » Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:32 am


anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#106

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:51 am

Got this error while trying to open this video.
The URL contained a malformed video ID.
Can't even find a video on youtube can you? How can you be expected to find the final revealed ayahs of the quran? Search harder, I will be waiting.

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#107

Unread post by pardesi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:09 am

Idiot wants everything handed to him on a platter, golden one at that!

Use your pea sized brains. Never mind, try this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efv-pj0xAGs

No wonder you can't find those ayats.

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#108

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:30 am

Not sure why you guys keep posting videos about Hazrat Ali. Are you guys trying to change the subject? Please tell me if you are incapable of discussing the topic that you yourselves started. Please let me know what the final revealed ayahs of the quran are. Otherwise you are not knowledgeable enough to discuss the quran or the person who knew the quran better than anyone else - Hazrat Ali. So, tell me, are you guys changing the subject now? I mean, it is ok to tell me that you are too scared to discuss what you started. I won't laugh.

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#109

Unread post by pardesi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:38 am

We are teaching you how to find those ayats. The videos are just part of the process. Did you find it in the first surah? No? Try Surah # 2?

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#110

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:56 am

I guess you will now ask me to read Harry Potter and the Sorceror's stone and the story about "He who must not be named" huh!! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#111

Unread post by znanwalla » Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:03 am

Now I know you are dumb...but then I did not realize you were so dumb ?

koi baat nahi...yeh enjoy karo nah....aap nahi toh koi aur toh kar saktah hai nah?

Superb performance!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOmL9AQybhE

zn

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#112

Unread post by znanwalla » Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:09 am

And in case you don't find it in the second sura then try the 3rd or 4th huh!If you try you will surely find it !!!!

Ali is the saqi of Kausar...
The Cup Bearer of the stream of Eternal Bliss in Paradise;
the fountainhead of Divine Ecstacy, and thus a source of a glorious inspiration for mystical verse.
As a source of pure ecstacy Ali is beyond folklore, myth and legend.
As a True Master, opens the eyes of your heart to the world and beyond.

zn

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#113

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:17 am

Yes, but do you have knowledge about the final revealed ayahs of the quran? That is what matters. Everything else is a facade.

znanwalla
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#114

Unread post by znanwalla » Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:20 am

We have so much knowledge that you look hollow to us !

Duniya mein aisi aur nigahe karam kahan
Dile se pukaar Ya Ali phir dekh gham kahan

zn

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#115

Unread post by pardesi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:13 am

Here is another link worth watching

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVEQjpWo ... re=related

Enjoy!

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#116

Unread post by pardesi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:18 am

Now watch Anajmi, Arif, MF, et al shout Shirk! Shirk! Shirk!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQ3izuBI ... re=related

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#117

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:11 am

Now watch Anajmi, Arif, MF, et al shout Shirk! Shirk! Shirk!
Ok, I won't shout. I will say very softly, whisper almost - shhirk, shhirk, shhirk. You are Ismailis, you begin and end with shirk. Unless of course you can produce the final ayahs of the quran and then I will think about discussing more.

dil-e-nadaan tujhe hua kya hai,
haay is dard ki dawa kya hai.

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#118

Unread post by pardesi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:47 am

anajmi wrote:
Now watch Anajmi, Arif, MF, et al shout Shirk! Shirk! Shirk!
Ok, I won't shout. I will say very softly, whisper almost - shhirk, shhirk, shhirk. You are Ismailis, you begin and end with shirk.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQ3izuBI ... re=related

I would like to see a certificate of your qualifications to issue an edict like Shirk. Who issued it - University of Morons at Lost Cause! Actually this guy is one of yours. So go and refute him as your time will be best served arguing with him, not here. Are we to believe that you are better educated and better equipped with knowledge than your ulema? Are you going to challenge his "intellectual capability" also. You will fall flat on your face Anajmi! Stop your nonsense. Here is another hint for you that might help you find the ayats you couldn't find so far. Try Chapter 113. If not there, try chapter 63, you will definitely find yourself mentioned there. Let me know if you need more hints.

anajmi
Posts: 13511
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#119

Unread post by anajmi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:50 am

pardesi,

Here is a hint for you. You will find the ayahs between surah 1 and suran 116. You have to add the 2 extra surahs that were hidden by some Ismaili Imam and some sunni (or some german) found in yemen. Couldn't even do one job properly now could you? Now let me know if you find them. Till then I don't think you are worthy of debating with me.

pardesi
Posts: 696
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 4:01 am

Re: Forum Rules

#120

Unread post by pardesi » Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:53 am

Oh dont worry about me Anajmi. I know exactly where they are hidden in the Quran. It is your test to find them but you refuse because you know whats coming next.