Separation of Agha Khan from Hafeez

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"The Aga Khan has emphasised the view of Islam as a thinking, spiritual faith, one that teaches compassion and tolerance and that upholds the dignity of man, Allah's noblest creation. In the Shia tradition of Islam, it is the mandate of the Imam of the time to safeguard the individual's right to personal intellectual search and to give practical expression to the ethical vision of society that the Islamic message inspires. Addressing the International Conference on the Example (Seerat) of the Prophet Muhammad in Karachi in 1976, the Aga Khan said that the wisdom of Allah's final Prophet in seeking new solutions for problems which could not be solved by traditional methods, provides the inspiration for Muslims to conceive a truly modern and dynamic society, without affecting the fundamental concepts of Islam. <p><br>Wait a minute!!!!!!!!! Did the Agha Khan references the wisdom of the Prophet in seeking methods to advance in today dynamic society, WITHOUT AFFECTING THE FUNDAMENTAL CONCEPTS OF ISLAM!!!!!!<p>The would mean...Agha Khanni have to follow the fundementals of Islam when apply to the modern society.<p>That would mean...Hafeez is making up his own religion..and not following his HI.<p>I'm telling!!!!!!

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I think Qiyam forgot the following:<p>" The Shia or "party" of Ali, already in existence during the lifetime of the Prophet, maintained that while the revelation ceased at the Prophet's death, the need for spiritual and moral guidance of the community, through an ongoing interpretation of the Islamic message, continued. They firmly believed that the legacy of Prophet Muhammad could only be entrusted to a member of his own family, in whom the Prophet had invested his authority through designation. That person was Ali, Prophet Muhammad's cousin, the husband of his daughter and only surviving child, Fatima, and his first supporter who had devoutly championed the cause of Islam and had earned the Prophet's trust and admiration. Their espousal of the right of Ali and that of his descendants, through Fatima, to the leadership of the community was rooted, above all, in their understanding of the Quran and its concept of qualified and rightly guided leadership, as reinforced by Prophetic traditions. The most prominent among the latter were part of the Prophet's sermon at a place called Ghadir Khumm, following his farewell pilgrimage, designating Ali as his successor, and his testament that he was leaving behind him "the two weighty things", namely the Quran and his progeny, for the future guidance of his community. "<p>and<p>" The present Imam has often spoken about the role of the intellect in the realm of the faith. Appropriately, he made the theme a centrepiece of his two inaugural addresses at the Aga Khan University: "In Islamic belief, knowledge is two-fold. There is that revealed through the Holy Prophet and that which man discovers by virtue of his own intellect. Nor do these two involve any contradiction, provided man remembers that his own mind is itself the creation of God. Without this humility, no balance is possible. With it, there are no barriers. Indeed, one strength of Islam has always lain in its belief that creation is not static but continuous, that through scientific and other endeavours, God has opened, and continues to open, new windows for us to see the marvels of His creation". <p>Muslims need not be apprehensive, he said, of these continuing journeys of the mind to comprehend the universe of God's creation, including one's own self. The tendency to restrict academic inquiry to the study of past accomplishments was at variance with the belief in the timeless relevance of the Islamic message. "Our faith has never been restricted to one place or one time. Ever since its revelation, the fundamental concept of Islam has been its universality and the fact that this is the last revelation, constantly valid, and not petrified into one period of man's history or confined to one area of the world." "<p>ref: http://www.iis.ac.uk/hhak/imamat_intro.htm<p>

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Has the Bohra Dai written anyting close to the quality of the above extracts from the Memoir of the Aga Khan III - Islam the Religion of My Ancestors.

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Dear Gora,<br>I did not forget that part...it is the bases of Imamate...and that is my point.<p>Shariah is taken from the traditions of the Prophet, and applied and adapted to be performed in today society...just as Agha Khan stated. This statment of Agha Khan also reinforced the idea that traditions are first and foremost valid then, now and tomorrow. They are adjusted for practice in today's culture...but not eliminated because of today's culture. This is what the Imam az'Zaman interprets. He doesn't change the practice..but establish means to practice the same practice today.<p>So I give the example of water for wudhu. The Prophet did wudhu from a running stream or well. In today world, the equivalent would be to use tap water for wudhu. Note...wudhu is still performed but the means of performing it are adapted.<p>This far different from the rhetoric of Br.Hafeez and Nizari. They say the Quran and traditions of the Prophet are only historical reference.

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I should add that Br. Nizari and Hafeez have stated they are not required to practice the pillars of Islam as the Prophet and Imams performed...this would go against the statements of the Agha Khan the you quoted.

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Look Qiyam, Aga Khan say one thing to Muslims and another to his followers. His followers follow the 'other thing'.<p>Whatever he says to Muslims is PR.

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and<p>" The succession of the line of prophecy by that of Imamat ensures the balance between the shariah or the exoteric aspect of the faith, and its esoteric, spiritual essence. Neither the exoteric nor the esoteric obliterates the other. While the Imam is the path to a believer's inward, spiritual elevation, he is also the authority who makes the shariah relevant according to the needs of time and universe. The inner, spiritual life in harmony with the exoteric, is a dimension of the faith that finds acceptance among many communities in both branches of Islam. "<p>"the Imam is... the authority who makes the shariah relevant according to the needs of time and universe."<p>ref: http://www.iis.ac.uk/hhak/imamat_intro.htm<p>It states clearly the position of the Nizari Shia Ismaili Muslim Imam.<p>

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Porus,<p>"Look Qiyam, Aga Khan say one thing to Muslims and another to his followers."<p>Presumably you have inside knowledge of what he says to his followers? And how did you obtain this knowledge?

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This QIYAM simply cannot seperate himself from the 7th century Sunnah. <p>He sees this 7th century 'ways' in everything one says or what he reads.<p>Thus, he expects everyone pillars to be based on "his" understanding of Islam as per "HIS" 7th century ways that are ABOVE TIME & SPACE.<p>And, he will keep coming from this angle because what else is he to do?<br>ACCEPT that the 7th century sunnah are just that - 7th century and BELONG in the 7th century.<p>"Do not write my ways. If you have then - destroy it." -- Prophet(saw)

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Dear Porus and ExMuslim,<br>One could assume that Agha Khan is selling PR to the muslims.<p>But I have a point to make here. Either Agha Khan is lying to the muslims regarding the statement I've quoted him making OR Br. Nizari and Hafeez are lying in what they say Agha Khannis are suppose to practice.<p>You can't have on both because there opposing statement.

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Qiyam<p>You are grabbing for straws admist your theolgical quicksand.<p>Only desperate people would have trouble understanding these words:<p>HI Quote from Seerat:<br>"..the wisdom of Allah's final Prophet in seeking new solutions for problems which could not be solved by traditional methods,<p> provides the inspiration for Muslims to conceive a truly modern and dynamic society, without affecting the fundamental concepts of Islam. "<p>REFLECT upon these:<br>1) "NEW Solutions for problems that could not be solved by traditional methods."<p>2)"provides the inspiration for Muslims to conceive a truly modern and dynamic society, without affecting the fundamental concepts of Islam. "<p>OBVIOUSLY, for you sunnahti & shariati there cannot be NEW SOLUTIONS because the TRADITIONAL METHODS of literal 7th century are:<br>ABOVE TIME & SPACE!<p>HENCE-forth there can be no inspiration because to deviate from these 7th century ideals are to DEVIATE from the fundamentals of Islam.<p><br>

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qiyam,<p>Is there a difference between fundamental concepts of Islam and sharia? What does sharia mean? Does it not mean jurisprudence? Are the Bohra fundamentals of Islam the same as those of the twelvers or of the wahabis? And are the fundamentals sub-divided into concepts, duties, rights etc? And am I asking too many questions?

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Dear ExMuslim,<br>Firstly, I really do hate your handle (no offense intended)..I wish you would change it.<p>Shariah means path or way and refers to the Islamic shariah (path). This Islamic shariah is composed of the concepts of practices and beliefs taught by the Prophet, as he was taught them from Allah.<p>The shariah does not include customs and rituals of the society in which the Prophet expounded these belief.<p>Fiqh or jurispurdence is the application of these concepts to everyday life in that society...to apply the Islamic concepts with their intent...to the practice in that society.<p>Most of the fundamentals concept of the all shiahs are the same. Sunnis variant with themselves...which differ with the shiah as well. Major beliefs for all are the same. The shiah draw from the practices of the Prophet and the exegsis and traditions as taught by the Imams for these practice of the Prophet. The idea is that the Prophet practiced and lived Islam as Allah wanted a muslim to practice. In fact the Imams themselves are examples of this as well, both in knowledge and practice.

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One point to add. The Imams interpret this shariah and adapt it to the understanding and practice of the muslim of that age. To do this, the Imam takes the tradition of the Prophet, with its intent, and adapts the practices in order to practice it in that society. The Imams cannot modify/eliminate a practice of the Prophet.

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Per Qiyam:<br>---The Imams interpret this shariah and adapt it to the understanding and practice of the muslim of that age. To do this, the Imam takes the tradition of the Prophet, with its intent, and adapts the practices in order to practice it in that society. The Imams cannot modify/eliminate a practice of the Prophet.---<p>Check out the FACADE of this mullah's language:<p>1)"The Imam interpret this shariah <br>2)adapt it to the understanding and practice of the muslim of that age"<p>QIYAM,<br>You are writing for the sake of writing only and to hear yourself write.<p>THERE is NO INTERPRETATION only "literal following" of the 7th century sunnah (ways).<p>To Quote your words:<br>"The Imams cannot modify/eliminate a practice of the Prophet"<p>So why did you BOTHER with the FACADE of the above!<p>TRANSLATION:<br>============<br>7th century sunnah is ETERNAL and<br>ABOVE SPACE & TIME. <p>Tell that to your dai & the Kothars re: Na-Mehrami.<p>Your theology is BANKRUPT!<br>

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Dear malaich qiyam,<p>===========================================<br>Most of the fundamentals concept of the all shiahs are the same. Sunnis variant with themselves...which differ with the shiah as well. <br>===========================================<p>Differing fundamentals. A contradiction in terms!<p>Take another puff<p>Babu the badshah

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Dear Baburao,<br>What I was refering to was concepts like amorphism of Allah...believing,like the wahabis, that Allah has an actual hand and face.

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qiyam,<p>So which concepts do you pick and choose to agree with? and who done the choosing for bohras?<p>One more puff<p>babu badmash

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qiyam,<p>SNIP......<br>Most of the fundamentals concept of the all shiahs are the same. Sunnis variant with themselves...which differ with the shiah as well.....SNIP<p>The way I see it when something is fundamental it forms the basis: it is essential. So if most but not all fundamentals are the same then no shiah or sunni sect is fully following the religion that the Prophet (SAW) taught. Perhaps that is why only one of the 73 sects will go to paradise. And which sect is it that has so totally adopted the fundamentals that the rest of the Muslims have castigated them as non-Muslims?<p>No brother qiyam, I am sure you meant all sects differ in their practical application of the fundamentals not in their acceptance of the fundaments themselves.<p>ExMuslim

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Dear Ex<br>Thank you...I did..except the example I quoted regarding wahabis. The concept that Allah has hands and a face is fundamental concept of Islam...one which the Wahabis have adapted..is against any madhab of Islam.