The Ismaili Imam, H.H. the Aga Khan is now visitng Kenya to celebrate his Diamond Jubilee. The Dai of Dawoodi Bohras H.H. Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin is also visiting Kenya, the 26th time.
The Aga Khan is establishing a new network of Aga Khan Academies - outstanding residential primary and secondary schools - teaching the International Baccalaureate and covering no less than 14 countries in Africa and Asia. The first of these is already functioning in Mombasa - I will visit there tomorrow to launch the building of its new residential campus. …………….. The Aga Khan University (Pakistan) is planning to establish a new Faculty of Health Sciences here in Nairobi. To my knowledge, this will be the first private sector university in Eastern Africa to create a full-fledged Faculty of Health Sciences offering under-graduate and post-graduate degrees in Medicine, Nursing and the allied health sciences. ………….. What we envision here in the coming years is an institution of some 1000 students and 175 faculty members, admitting students on a merit basis. Our new facilities, including a teaching hospital of 500 beds, will eventually occupy some 80,000 square meters. The total investment over the next fifteen years will be about 250 million dollars. When the project is complete, the Aga Khan University in Kenya alone will employ over 4000 people….”
http://www.akdn.org/news/2007ea.htm
The Bohra leader visited Malindi township in Kenya to open up a repaired and new and imparoved Bohri Mosque. This has been his passion and obsession - to demolish old mosques )"bhaang fod"), throughout the Bohri world and hence one day secure his name in the Guineess Book of World Record of the person who had demolished and rebuilt the most number of mosques. Then he will fly out to Tanzania, which he regularly does, for a hunting trip of wild animals.
http://www.nairobijamaat.co.ke/visit.html
Whilst the Aga Khan is interested in the academic well being of not only the Ismaili Khojas but of the whole humaniaty, the Bohri leader is only interested in building mosques and meeting with the world secular leaders to massage his own ego etc.
The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
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Al Zulfiqar
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
very true brother.
take canada for instance. after the ugandan upheaval 50,000 ismailis were given permanent refugee status in canada by the govt, just on the word of HH Aga Khan, who was a close personal friend of the then PM Pierre Trudeau. He undertook full responsibility for their air uplift, housing, living expenses and help in finding jobs. Plane loads of ismailis arrived day and night and today they are amongst the most prosperous of all immigrants.
our syedna...? he declared that "tamara haq ma dua farmaveli che!" same thing for ismailis from somalia and same thing for the few bohras in somalia who were looted 3 times over until they had nothing to eat and begged nearby jamaats in mombasa and daressalaam for help. they were informed by return telex, "aqa maula ye tamara haq ma beshumar dua farmavi che". it was only a philantropic bohra businessman in kenya who evacuated the 60 odd bohras by dhow at his personal expense. 2 died and 3 were badly injured during the risky evacuation. the able ones from among them this kind man gave them jobs. the rest of the old and ill, incl ladies, were given temporary free housing at the musafirkhana by the mombasa jamat. after 6 months they were told to pay the rent or vacate. most of the old men and women did not survive the trauma and humiliation and died lonely and neglected. i have personally witnessed their fate and at that time uttered silent laanats against this beraham and besharam family which rules over us. i helped monetarily as much as i could being a non-resident.
there was no help from any bohra organisation or kothar to help rehabilitate them. this is the story everywhere in the world. the kothar only knows how to take and when u ask for any help, they give u kicks in return or insults, saying, "su tamne lage che ke aa koi khairaati bank che?"
i can give countless instances of how the Aga Khansaheb has helped and is helping his community and the world with concrete projects, whilst our shafiq bawa and his family give only propaganda, false promises and lies. as we say "hatheli ma chaand dekhare che". they jet around, hog on rich ziyafats, loot, plunder, live a lavish life, all at our expense.
the Aga Khan has many lucrative, open business ventures in which he has invested very shrewdly. the profits are plowed back to help the community and humanity worldwide. that is why he is held in such great respect. whereas our dai-e-allah..? he buys, bribes and greases palms of petty officials to get respect, like a petty thief who craves respectabilty!
tell me what else can one do after seeing the sorrows of our poor and neglected bohras all over the world, except shed tears and curse the parasites who are exploiting them in the name of religion? khuda ni laanat a berahamo upar.
take canada for instance. after the ugandan upheaval 50,000 ismailis were given permanent refugee status in canada by the govt, just on the word of HH Aga Khan, who was a close personal friend of the then PM Pierre Trudeau. He undertook full responsibility for their air uplift, housing, living expenses and help in finding jobs. Plane loads of ismailis arrived day and night and today they are amongst the most prosperous of all immigrants.
our syedna...? he declared that "tamara haq ma dua farmaveli che!" same thing for ismailis from somalia and same thing for the few bohras in somalia who were looted 3 times over until they had nothing to eat and begged nearby jamaats in mombasa and daressalaam for help. they were informed by return telex, "aqa maula ye tamara haq ma beshumar dua farmavi che". it was only a philantropic bohra businessman in kenya who evacuated the 60 odd bohras by dhow at his personal expense. 2 died and 3 were badly injured during the risky evacuation. the able ones from among them this kind man gave them jobs. the rest of the old and ill, incl ladies, were given temporary free housing at the musafirkhana by the mombasa jamat. after 6 months they were told to pay the rent or vacate. most of the old men and women did not survive the trauma and humiliation and died lonely and neglected. i have personally witnessed their fate and at that time uttered silent laanats against this beraham and besharam family which rules over us. i helped monetarily as much as i could being a non-resident.
there was no help from any bohra organisation or kothar to help rehabilitate them. this is the story everywhere in the world. the kothar only knows how to take and when u ask for any help, they give u kicks in return or insults, saying, "su tamne lage che ke aa koi khairaati bank che?"
i can give countless instances of how the Aga Khansaheb has helped and is helping his community and the world with concrete projects, whilst our shafiq bawa and his family give only propaganda, false promises and lies. as we say "hatheli ma chaand dekhare che". they jet around, hog on rich ziyafats, loot, plunder, live a lavish life, all at our expense.
the Aga Khan has many lucrative, open business ventures in which he has invested very shrewdly. the profits are plowed back to help the community and humanity worldwide. that is why he is held in such great respect. whereas our dai-e-allah..? he buys, bribes and greases palms of petty officials to get respect, like a petty thief who craves respectabilty!
tell me what else can one do after seeing the sorrows of our poor and neglected bohras all over the world, except shed tears and curse the parasites who are exploiting them in the name of religion? khuda ni laanat a berahamo upar.
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Muslim First
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
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Prophet SAW said:
As reported by Abdullah bin Masud as recorded by Abu Dawud and at-Tirmidhi
By Allah, you must enjoin good and forbid evil; you must catch hold of oppressor's hand and give him severe warning to stick to truth, or Allah will surely set up hearts of some of you against those of others, and then He will certainly curse you.
As reported by 'Adiyya bin 'Umayarah as recorded by Ahmed
Allah does not punish the individuals for the sins of the community untill they see the evil spreading among themselves , and while they have power to stop it, do not do so
Wasalaam
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Prophet SAW said:
As reported by Abdullah bin Masud as recorded by Abu Dawud and at-Tirmidhi
By Allah, you must enjoin good and forbid evil; you must catch hold of oppressor's hand and give him severe warning to stick to truth, or Allah will surely set up hearts of some of you against those of others, and then He will certainly curse you.
As reported by 'Adiyya bin 'Umayarah as recorded by Ahmed
Allah does not punish the individuals for the sins of the community untill they see the evil spreading among themselves , and while they have power to stop it, do not do so
Wasalaam
.
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Muslim First
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
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Before you admire it and praise it please inform us what kind of businesses he is investing?
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True;the Aga Khan has many lucrative, open business ventures in which he has invested very shrewdly. the profits are plowed back to help the community and humanity worldwide
Before you admire it and praise it please inform us what kind of businesses he is investing?
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Al Zulfiqar
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
MF,
it is clear from the way you have worded yr question and its overall tone that u seem to harbour some deep seated prejudices against the Aga Khan.
it also appears that u are aware of his businesses but are pretending ignorance so that u can then begin a debate on what is halal and haraam etc from an idealistic islamic point of view. let me remind u, that nothing in this world can be run on purely idealistic lines, the realities of the world unfortunately do count. as long as the greater good is achieved and with good intentions, then atleast it is better than the outright looting and immorality of the bohra kothar, who then have the temerity to utter laanats against all other muslims and faiths!
look at the example of dubai, although being an islamic country, the progress it has achieved is phenomenal, riding on the back of liberalism and a more modern and benign islam. not the brand of perverted and twisted style of society which is saudi arabia and which is precisely what is giving a bad name to islam.
an ismaili will be better qualified to answer yr tongue-in-cheek query. take yr debate elsewhere.
it is clear from the way you have worded yr question and its overall tone that u seem to harbour some deep seated prejudices against the Aga Khan.
it also appears that u are aware of his businesses but are pretending ignorance so that u can then begin a debate on what is halal and haraam etc from an idealistic islamic point of view. let me remind u, that nothing in this world can be run on purely idealistic lines, the realities of the world unfortunately do count. as long as the greater good is achieved and with good intentions, then atleast it is better than the outright looting and immorality of the bohra kothar, who then have the temerity to utter laanats against all other muslims and faiths!
look at the example of dubai, although being an islamic country, the progress it has achieved is phenomenal, riding on the back of liberalism and a more modern and benign islam. not the brand of perverted and twisted style of society which is saudi arabia and which is precisely what is giving a bad name to islam.
an ismaili will be better qualified to answer yr tongue-in-cheek query. take yr debate elsewhere.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
On this board, MF is the only Muslim(?) who follows the Quran and Hadith literally. Which means, he believes that the Prophet uttered a wish to skip prayers and burn the houses of Muslims who did not join prayers and that at age 50, Prophet slept with a 9 year old Ayesha.
With Muslims like that, who needs its enemies?
By the way, MF, did you finally determine the direction of the Qibla? Is it SE in Boston?
With Muslims like that, who needs its enemies?
By the way, MF, did you finally determine the direction of the Qibla? Is it SE in Boston?
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
It is amazing how the disbelievers want the prophet and even Allah himself to behave as they feel fit when they refuse to behave as commanded by Allah and his prophet!! Allah becomes a sadist and achizophrenic and the prophet becomes an arsonist and a pedophile nauzubillah.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
AlZ
Apparently the kotharis started out just like you. "What is the harm in doing this and then what is the harm in doing it this way. We have to take the realities of the world into consideration, if we keep giving zakat to the poor we will never be able to fulfill our dreams, let's just keep the zakat for ourselves and find other ways of fooling the bohras. We have to take the realities of the world into consideration"!!
Apparently the kotharis started out just like you. "What is the harm in doing this and then what is the harm in doing it this way. We have to take the realities of the world into consideration, if we keep giving zakat to the poor we will never be able to fulfill our dreams, let's just keep the zakat for ourselves and find other ways of fooling the bohras. We have to take the realities of the world into consideration"!!
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Muslim First
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
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Br. Porus
Qibla direction in Boston is 60.476774 (From North Clockwise)and Kabah is 6215.06 miles away.
Tha is
60.476774 = N 60 Degree 28' and 36.39" E
Br. Zulficar
AS
I do not wish to engage in debate about Aga Khan.
You must admit that there is a difference between living Imam and resident of Dubai.
If I were a Imam then I will make sure I follow commands of Quran and my ancestor Prophet SAW.
BTW there are many ways to invest money Halal way and prosper.
Have a Good Jumma
Wasalaam
.
Br. Porus
Qibla direction in Boston is 60.476774 (From North Clockwise)and Kabah is 6215.06 miles away.
Tha is
60.476774 = N 60 Degree 28' and 36.39" E
Br. Zulficar
AS
I do not wish to engage in debate about Aga Khan.
You must admit that there is a difference between living Imam and resident of Dubai.
If I were a Imam then I will make sure I follow commands of Quran and my ancestor Prophet SAW.
BTW there are many ways to invest money Halal way and prosper.
Have a Good Jumma
Wasalaam
.
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Muslim First
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
.
Here is good website to find prayer times and Qibla direction.
http://www.islamicfinder.org/
BTW best way to find Qibla is to
http://www.islamicfinder.org/sunQiblah. ... r=2007&lan g=
.
Here is good website to find prayer times and Qibla direction.
http://www.islamicfinder.org/
BTW best way to find Qibla is to
http://www.islamicfinder.org/sunQiblah. ... r=2007&lan g=
.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Another Qibla Locator:
http://www.qiblalocator.com/
Great site to determine distances between two points on earth both surface distance and great circle distance:
http://www.wcrl.ars.usda.gov/cec/java/lat-long.htm
A DIY method is to draw two great circles of longitude from any location. One goes through the North Pole and the other through Makkah, as if it is a pole. The intersection of the two great circles is the Qibla Direction. Simple, eh?
Actually the shortest distance between any location and Makkah is not along the surface of the earth at all. It is along spherical chord going through the interior of the earth. In that case, you will need to a dig a hole in the ground and then, acrobat fashion, suspend yourself from a system of pulleys to perform your namaaz arkaans.
http://www.qiblalocator.com/
Great site to determine distances between two points on earth both surface distance and great circle distance:
http://www.wcrl.ars.usda.gov/cec/java/lat-long.htm
A DIY method is to draw two great circles of longitude from any location. One goes through the North Pole and the other through Makkah, as if it is a pole. The intersection of the two great circles is the Qibla Direction. Simple, eh?
Actually the shortest distance between any location and Makkah is not along the surface of the earth at all. It is along spherical chord going through the interior of the earth. In that case, you will need to a dig a hole in the ground and then, acrobat fashion, suspend yourself from a system of pulleys to perform your namaaz arkaans.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
A good point made by the islamicfinder website is that the Magnetic Compass cannot be used to find the Qibla, unless it has been corrected for the geographic North Pole.
Magnetic Compass points to the North Magnetic Pole.
Magnetic Compass points to the North Magnetic Pole.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
The point is not about how disbelievers want Prophet to behave. It is about what the believers say about how he behaved.Originally posted by anajmi:
It is amazing how the disbelievers want the prophet and even Allah himself to behave as they feel fit when they refuse to behave as commanded by Allah and his prophet!! Allah becomes a sadist and achizophrenic and the prophet becomes an arsonist and a pedophile nauzubillah.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Al Zulf,
Sorry about this interjection of my posts. So that it does not become another porus-anajmi duologue, I will abstain from further contribution to this thread.
Sorry about this interjection of my posts. So that it does not become another porus-anajmi duologue, I will abstain from further contribution to this thread.
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ponga bhori
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
our syedna...? he declared that "tamara haq ma dua farmaveli che!" .......... "aqa maula ye tamara haq ma beshumar dua farmavi che".
May be those dua were heard, Allah knows best.
Dua do work.
May be those dua were heard, Allah knows best.
Dua do work.
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Al Zulfiqar
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
anajmi, now u are bent upon creating fitnat by way of exaggeration and excess and deliberately splitting hairs. i have never said that it is ok for the syedna and his family to loot the community, so why are u intentionally creating debates where there are none?Originally posted by anajmi:
AlZ
Apparently the kotharis started out just like you. "What is the harm in doing this and then what is the harm in doing it this way. We have to take the realities of the world into consideration, if we keep giving zakat to the poor we will never be able to fulfill our dreams, let's just keep the zakat for ourselves and find other ways of fooling the bohras. We have to take the realities of the world into consideration"!!
here is my exact quote. " as long as the greater good is achieved and with good intentions, then atleast it is better than the outright looting and immorality of the bohra kothar, who then have the temerity to utter laanats against all other muslims and faiths!"
if you get yr daily fix & kicks by misquoting others and engaging in incessant and unending arguments then u are welcome to do so with those such inclined. i refuse to be drawn into nonsensical debates with u, and if it pleases u, u are always right. so there.... now u can go back to sucking yr thumb in peace or move to pakistan where there are many more of yr ilk to share yr venom. i will ignore u from now on.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
BREAKING NEWS MR ASGARALI IS FLYING TO EAST AFRICA ALONG WITH ANOTHER PROG :p
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
porus,
I am not sure it was the believers who said Allah was a sadist and a schizophrenic. It was you. I am also not sure that the believers called the prophet a pedophile and an arsonist. It was you.
AlZ.
Please don't talk about intentionally creating debates over here. No debates exist till people create them and you should know that very well. If you don't want debates stop posting.
What is this greater good that you are talking about? In order to achieve the greater good, the Ismailis have all but given up everything that makes Islam, Islam. The living Imam gambles, drinks, his daughters are married to non-muslims. At least the kotharis are pretending to be muslims and show some respect for the sunnah of the prophet. With the likes of you around they will be giving up that mask too. And I never said you said it was ok for the syedna to loot the bohras. I just that that is how things start by "taking the realities of the world into consideration".
I am not sure it was the believers who said Allah was a sadist and a schizophrenic. It was you. I am also not sure that the believers called the prophet a pedophile and an arsonist. It was you.
AlZ.
Please don't talk about intentionally creating debates over here. No debates exist till people create them and you should know that very well. If you don't want debates stop posting.
What is this greater good that you are talking about? In order to achieve the greater good, the Ismailis have all but given up everything that makes Islam, Islam. The living Imam gambles, drinks, his daughters are married to non-muslims. At least the kotharis are pretending to be muslims and show some respect for the sunnah of the prophet. With the likes of you around they will be giving up that mask too. And I never said you said it was ok for the syedna to loot the bohras. I just that that is how things start by "taking the realities of the world into consideration".
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
anajmi,
al Zulfiqar has accurately described you as the one who wants to argue and win every time. I agree with him and I let you win.
I invited you to reject a hadith that claims Prophet had sex with a 9 year old and another one that claims he wished he could burn the houses. You rejected my invitation. I have rejected the hadiths. Since you do not disown them, it is you, not me, that calls the Prophet a pedophile and an arsonist.
I have written many times on this board that there is absolutely nothing that one can say about God. What I report is what you say about God. I interpreted your understanding.
God is a sadist because he wants to see sinners burn. That is what you say. Why does he want to do that? If not to enjoy than what? He wants to show sinners how infintely cruel he can be? If he is also infinitely compassionate and merciful at the same time then, it is you who are calling him schizoprenic, not me.
You say he wants you to do as he commands but he is the one who will allow you to do that or prevent you from doing it. That means it is you who are calling him schizophrenic, not me.
Again, I re-assert. There is absolutely nothing anyone can say about God. Quran talks in analogies to make ancient middle eastern humans understand. Quran completely ignored ancient philosophies that has things to say about God long before Quran was revealed. Greeks, Egyptians, Hindus, Chinese etc. These philosophies treated humans as more intellectually clever than Quran treats them.
Quran only became what it is after later generations interpreted it and ascribed meanings to it, which may or may not have been intended by the Prophet, who alone can verify its current disparate interpretations. And he is not available to do so.
And you win.
al Zulfiqar has accurately described you as the one who wants to argue and win every time. I agree with him and I let you win.
I invited you to reject a hadith that claims Prophet had sex with a 9 year old and another one that claims he wished he could burn the houses. You rejected my invitation. I have rejected the hadiths. Since you do not disown them, it is you, not me, that calls the Prophet a pedophile and an arsonist.
I have written many times on this board that there is absolutely nothing that one can say about God. What I report is what you say about God. I interpreted your understanding.
God is a sadist because he wants to see sinners burn. That is what you say. Why does he want to do that? If not to enjoy than what? He wants to show sinners how infintely cruel he can be? If he is also infinitely compassionate and merciful at the same time then, it is you who are calling him schizoprenic, not me.
You say he wants you to do as he commands but he is the one who will allow you to do that or prevent you from doing it. That means it is you who are calling him schizophrenic, not me.
Again, I re-assert. There is absolutely nothing anyone can say about God. Quran talks in analogies to make ancient middle eastern humans understand. Quran completely ignored ancient philosophies that has things to say about God long before Quran was revealed. Greeks, Egyptians, Hindus, Chinese etc. These philosophies treated humans as more intellectually clever than Quran treats them.
Quran only became what it is after later generations interpreted it and ascribed meanings to it, which may or may not have been intended by the Prophet, who alone can verify its current disparate interpretations. And he is not available to do so.
And you win.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Sorry again,al Zulfiqar,
I forgot that I had promised I would not post on this thread. I won't now, promise!
I forgot that I had promised I would not post on this thread. I won't now, promise!
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ponga bhori
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Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
In religion there is an "ideal" person besides a GOD:
May it be a Prophet,Immam,Dai infact even Reform Leader.
It becomes difficult to critize this person, the believer in him shall come vehmently in defence of such a person.
When the arguements are against the (my) GOD believed in, there shall be an agruement but with the backing of "GOD will look after the offender.
It would be best that we do not agrue about each others "the IDEAL" person or believed GOD. For no matter how good it shall take no where.
Let's debate RELIGION.
May it be a Prophet,Immam,Dai infact even Reform Leader.
It becomes difficult to critize this person, the believer in him shall come vehmently in defence of such a person.
When the arguements are against the (my) GOD believed in, there shall be an agruement but with the backing of "GOD will look after the offender.
It would be best that we do not agrue about each others "the IDEAL" person or believed GOD. For no matter how good it shall take no where.
Let's debate RELIGION.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
porus,
You are an extremely shallow person. A coward too. One who doesn't have the balls to even accept his own words.
I wonder, if you had been living at the time of the prophet, would you have been in the company of the prophet or Abu Lahab/Abu Jahl? I don't think people will need more than one guess to figure that out. You have already displayed your willingness to kill the prophet if Hazrat Ayesha were your daughter.
Besides, what is the point in arguing with a person who will go back on his word in a moment's notice?
Now I invite you to accept the hadith where the prophet asks you to pray 5 times a day and fast during Ramadan. Let us see you reject that invitation.
And now I will let myself win. Al Zulfikar is right, if I want to participate in a debate, it is not so that I can let others win, specially if they are wrong.
You are an extremely shallow person. A coward too. One who doesn't have the balls to even accept his own words.
I wonder, if you had been living at the time of the prophet, would you have been in the company of the prophet or Abu Lahab/Abu Jahl? I don't think people will need more than one guess to figure that out. You have already displayed your willingness to kill the prophet if Hazrat Ayesha were your daughter.
Besides, what is the point in arguing with a person who will go back on his word in a moment's notice?
Now I invite you to accept the hadith where the prophet asks you to pray 5 times a day and fast during Ramadan. Let us see you reject that invitation.
And now I will let myself win. Al Zulfikar is right, if I want to participate in a debate, it is not so that I can let others win, specially if they are wrong.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Apart from attributing sadism and schizophrenia to God, you are now attributing extremem shortsightedness to him too. God isn't like you who can't think beyond his next post. What is the point in being the possessor of infinite knowledge and sending a messenger with a message if the recipients of the message are unable to understand the message after the messenger leaves? God isn't stupid, nauzubillah, as you think he is. He sent a message which is easy to understand.Quran only became what it is after later generations interpreted it and ascribed meanings to it, which may or may not have been intended by the Prophet, who alone can verify its current disparate interpretations. And he is not available to do so.
However, for people like you, understanding the message becomes a problem cause now you have to believe, pray 5 times a day, and fast during Ramadan. Wouldn't it be easy to claim that the message cannot be understood anymore? Specially if you can lay your hands on hadith which you can use against the prophet.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Ah, you know why? Cause the quran is the word of God, a being far more superior, intellectually, than humans. One of the reasons why disbelievers like yourself have completely missed the point of the message. No wonder you haven't understood it.Quran completely ignored ancient philosophies that has things to say about God long before Quran was revealed. Greeks, Egyptians, Hindus, Chinese etc. These philosophies treated humans as more intellectually clever than Quran treats them.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
This is what the quran says
002.039
YUSUFALI: "But those who reject Faith and belie Our Signs, they shall be companions of the Fire; they shall abide therein."
ARBERRY: "As for the unbelievers who cry lies to Our signs, those shall be the inhabitants of the Fire, therein dwelling forever."
Pretty clear!! So what do the disbelievers like porus do? Easy, reject the translations of the quran. Declare that the quran cannot be understood anymore. And blame those who believe in the message for calling God a sadist.
This is similar to the American administration calling those that are against the war as those that support terrorism.
002.039
YUSUFALI: "But those who reject Faith and belie Our Signs, they shall be companions of the Fire; they shall abide therein."
ARBERRY: "As for the unbelievers who cry lies to Our signs, those shall be the inhabitants of the Fire, therein dwelling forever."
Pretty clear!! So what do the disbelievers like porus do? Easy, reject the translations of the quran. Declare that the quran cannot be understood anymore. And blame those who believe in the message for calling God a sadist.
This is similar to the American administration calling those that are against the war as those that support terrorism.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Actually, if you were to read the quran you would find a lot that one can say about God. And by God I am referring to Allah and not to your pet Tao who cannot be talked about. Considering how much you talk about him, I'd say Lao Tzu must be turning in his grave!!I have written many times on this board that there is absolutely nothing that one can say about God.
Unlike the prophet who is not with us to clarify your interpretation of his understanding, I am right here and I am telling you that you have been misinterpreting my undestanding, purposely, I might add. So desist from reporting falsehood and attributing it to others like a coward while hiding behind Al Zulfikar.What I report is what you say about God. I interpreted your understanding.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Some relevant ayahs of the quran
018.100
YUSUFALI: And We shall present Hell that day for Unbelievers to see, all spread out,-
ARBERRY: and upon that day We shall present Gehenna to the unbelievers
018.103
YUSUFALI: Say: "Shall we tell you of those who lose most in respect of their deeds?-
ARBERRY: 'Shall We tell you who will be the greatest losers in their works?
018.104
YUSUFALI: "Those whose efforts have been wasted in this life, while they thought that they were acquiring good by their works?"
ARBERRY: Those whose striving goes astray in the present life, while they think that they are working good deeds.
018.105
YUSUFALI: They are those who deny the Signs of their Lord and the fact of their having to meet Him (in the Hereafter): vain will be their works, nor shall We, on the Day of Judgment, give them any weight.
ARBERRY: Those are they that disbelieve in the signs of their Lord and the encounter with Him; their works have failed, and on the Day of Resurrection We shall not assign to them any weight.
018.106
YUSUFALI: That is their reward, Hell, because they rejected Faith, and took My Signs and My Messengers by way of jest.
ARBERRY: That is their recompense -- Gehenna for that they were unbelievers and took My signs and My messengers in mockery.
018.100
YUSUFALI: And We shall present Hell that day for Unbelievers to see, all spread out,-
ARBERRY: and upon that day We shall present Gehenna to the unbelievers
018.103
YUSUFALI: Say: "Shall we tell you of those who lose most in respect of their deeds?-
ARBERRY: 'Shall We tell you who will be the greatest losers in their works?
018.104
YUSUFALI: "Those whose efforts have been wasted in this life, while they thought that they were acquiring good by their works?"
ARBERRY: Those whose striving goes astray in the present life, while they think that they are working good deeds.
018.105
YUSUFALI: They are those who deny the Signs of their Lord and the fact of their having to meet Him (in the Hereafter): vain will be their works, nor shall We, on the Day of Judgment, give them any weight.
ARBERRY: Those are they that disbelieve in the signs of their Lord and the encounter with Him; their works have failed, and on the Day of Resurrection We shall not assign to them any weight.
018.106
YUSUFALI: That is their reward, Hell, because they rejected Faith, and took My Signs and My Messengers by way of jest.
ARBERRY: That is their recompense -- Gehenna for that they were unbelievers and took My signs and My messengers in mockery.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Going back to the missive and the original subject of this missive:
Re: transparency when it comes to moneys being donated to charitable organizations, the Aga Khan Development Network is an entity (unlike the Bohris) which I believe has full disclosure and accountability. One can make a pledge, receive periodic statements and receipts whenever hi/her check is cashed thru the local agency The Aga Khan Foundation USA. There are numerous agencies under AKDN network, registered as non-profit organizations operating under Swiss Law. If you go to this site below you can find links for the various agencies and descriptions, financial statements etc. So for the Aga Khan Foundation in 2006 they had an income of 253.7 million dollars and administrative costs of 20.9 million dollars and so on.
http://www.akdn.org/
The monies collected are donations from various members of the Community. These are not monies given as a religious tithe or an offering at some religious ceremony. These are monies donated directly for charitable purposes . There are many fund raising activities as one would see in any close knit community. There are annual walks for example. (I am sure a Google search will show what I mean) So for example a 2001-2002 Partnership Walk Campaign raised 3.2 million dollars over 4 walks held in Houston, Los Angeles, Dallas and Atlanta on 4 consecutive Sundays. The participants include non Ismailis, celebrities from Political and Entertainment arenas etc.
As opposed to the Bohris, there has never been any coercion, pressure or even so much as a suggestion made that an individual must donate. Many do not, Many Ismailis have not in several years. The most amazing thing that Ismailis have personally seen numerous timers in both Kenya and here in the west is how so many people will pledge a fantastic huge sum of money at a very impromptu fund raiser without blinking once. This is not limited of course to the Ismaili community by any means but a lot of people do have a strong belief that they have succeeded financially because of the community in which they were raised and have a strong desire to give back.
Re: transparency when it comes to moneys being donated to charitable organizations, the Aga Khan Development Network is an entity (unlike the Bohris) which I believe has full disclosure and accountability. One can make a pledge, receive periodic statements and receipts whenever hi/her check is cashed thru the local agency The Aga Khan Foundation USA. There are numerous agencies under AKDN network, registered as non-profit organizations operating under Swiss Law. If you go to this site below you can find links for the various agencies and descriptions, financial statements etc. So for the Aga Khan Foundation in 2006 they had an income of 253.7 million dollars and administrative costs of 20.9 million dollars and so on.
http://www.akdn.org/
The monies collected are donations from various members of the Community. These are not monies given as a religious tithe or an offering at some religious ceremony. These are monies donated directly for charitable purposes . There are many fund raising activities as one would see in any close knit community. There are annual walks for example. (I am sure a Google search will show what I mean) So for example a 2001-2002 Partnership Walk Campaign raised 3.2 million dollars over 4 walks held in Houston, Los Angeles, Dallas and Atlanta on 4 consecutive Sundays. The participants include non Ismailis, celebrities from Political and Entertainment arenas etc.
As opposed to the Bohris, there has never been any coercion, pressure or even so much as a suggestion made that an individual must donate. Many do not, Many Ismailis have not in several years. The most amazing thing that Ismailis have personally seen numerous timers in both Kenya and here in the west is how so many people will pledge a fantastic huge sum of money at a very impromptu fund raiser without blinking once. This is not limited of course to the Ismaili community by any means but a lot of people do have a strong belief that they have succeeded financially because of the community in which they were raised and have a strong desire to give back.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
I asked a question about the quran and the sunnah at akdn.org. Never got a reply back. If I had sent a check, I am sure it would've been cashed immediately. If all you care about is money and it's accounting then you are better off becoming an Ismaili.
Re: The Bohra Dai and the Ismaili Imam visiting East Africa
Allah says in the quranI have written many times on this board that there is absolutely nothing that one can say about God.
002.152
YUSUFALI: Then do ye remember Me; I will remember you. Be grateful to Me, and reject not Faith.
004.142
YUSUFALI: The Hypocrites - they think they are over-reaching Allah, but He will over-reach them: When they stand up to prayer, they stand without earnestness, to be seen of men, but little do they hold Allah in remembrance;
005.007
YUSUFALI: And call in remembrance the favour of Allah unto you, and His covenant, which He ratified with you, when ye said: "We hear and we obey": And fear Allah, for Allah knoweth well the secrets of your hearts.
005.011
YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! Call in remembrance the favour of Allah unto you when certain men formed the design to stretch out their hands against you, but (Allah) held back their hands from you: so fear Allah. And on Allah let believers put (all) their trust.
005.020
YUSUFALI: Remember Moses said to his people: "O my people! Call in remembrance the favour of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples.
029.045
YUSUFALI: Recite what is sent of the Book by inspiration to thee, and establish regular Prayer: for Prayer restrains from shameful and unjust deeds; and remembrance of Allah is the greatest (thing in life) without doubt. And Allah knows the (deeds) that ye do.
And many more such ayahs which require you to remember Allah and his favors upon you, normally termed as Zikr of Allah. If there were nothing one could say about God, Zikr would be impossible.