Reformists Convention In Udaipur

[Aarif]

And this is what it would seem they deserve because they do nothing to change their situation.

And neither do the fake ID participants on this site.

Woh kyaa kehte hein

"Baaton mein koi dum nahin
Phir bhi hum kissi se kum nahin"

[Humsafar]

And neither do the fake ID participants on this site.

This is a classic non-sequitur, meaning fake ids is a different issue and nothing to do with your ridicule "Who told you that Bohra community uses the democratic model???".

And in any case it is wrong to assume that all those who use a fake id do nothing but talk.

[Aarif]

I never said that all with fake IDs are fake. The classic example is you. I have always respected you for your knowledge on reform movement. I am referring to some others. And they know what I am talking about...

[Aarif]

And this is what it would seem they deserve because they do nothing to change their situation.

This is what u wrote..

If I club two sentences then it becomes

And this is what it would seem they deserve because they do nothing to change their situation. And neither do the fake ID participants on this site.

Now it makes sense if you get the point...

[Danish]

Originally posted by Aareef:
The only thing kothar is selling them is the community feeling. You remain a Dawoodi Bohra if you pay up...

"Community feeling if you pay up", LOL, or is it really "Faith by Bribery"; in other words....absolute dictatorship in the name of Panjatan Paak and Hazir-e-Imaam by the consensus of a fathomless deity. ROFL

I am yet to come accross ordinary people (who form the major mass of our community) going to Kothar willingly and paying them...

I've seen and heard almost every Bohra visit Kothar willingly for whatever personal reasons and paying them. You may call it the services of Kothar sanctioned by an "Allah". When their "incomes" subside or their pockets getting empty, the Kothar dictate visitations to balance their budget or fill their pockets. I myself am an example of such bigotry on several occasions.

The bottom line is that most of the bohras do not have a choice

. All have choice(s); what they don't have is enough "brains". They love "channa chaat", "mirchi masala" and "khata khat".

However, let's assume for a moment that what you are saying is true. Even then cursing and abusing the community on this site is not going to help in any way. Spreading awareness in the best possible way is the only solution. By using abusive language at every possible opportunity is just going to take the mainstream bohras away from the truth that the reformists are trying to spread. Also, note that this is spoiling the image of reformists and their movement in the eyes if mainstream bohras.

That is all well articulated and good advice, but one must differentiate between abusiveness and criticism. Criticism often alludes or reflected to abuse which may not be the intent but I understand sometimes people do get carried away out of sheer frustration.

[S. Insaf]

I was wondering why out of so many speakers in the recent World Conference at Udaipur only Justice Sachar was targeted by a false allegation that he “had created a row after his statement on birth place of Hindu god Ram, which led to raising alarm bells among the majority Hindus & group of people had gathered at the Bohra mosque where the convention was taking place. …. Fortunately the incident passed off peacefully without any major untoward incident”, as fabricated by our friend, udaipurresident?

For an answer I looked back in the history of reform movement and found quite a few incidents of this nature. For example I was reminded of the world-wide protest against a progressive Congress M.P., Mr. Shashi Bhushan who had addressed a meeting of progressive Bohras at Nagpada Neighbourhood House on 22nd Nov. 1974. In his address beside other things he had announced that he would certainly raise the issue in the Indian Parliament regarding the Bohra high priest’s income in the name of religion and charitable properties of the community under his control and would insist on enacting an Act on the lines of Ajmer Dargah Sharif Act to regulate them. Loosing control over community’s Wealth and the Properties are most hurting for Kothar. But Kothar does not want this interior motive to be made public. So Mr. Bhushan was blamed for calling Sayedna a “Shaitan” and in order to crush his efforts a world-wide propaganda was raised against him and he was made to apologise for some thing which had not said.

In the recent Conference in Udaipur Justice Shachar was the only speaker who openly said that he would take up the matter of Review Petition in the Supreme Court regarding Excommunication Act with the President of India. Loosing right to excommunication means loosing control over the community’s wealth and properties. Hence he was the only speaker who was targeted.

But this time since the master-mind, Yusuf Najmuddin has gone and buried, Kothar’s remaining apprentices could not make it a high-pitched issue. Also because Kothar still hopes that some how or other they would manage to win the excommunication case.

[like_minded]

What do you think? Bohras cough up money every now and then out of their pockets because they love to do it... This is not even common sense. The only thing kothar is selling them is the community feeling. You remain a Dawoodi Bohra if you pay up... I am yet to come accross ordinary people (who form the major mass of our community) going to Kothar willingly and paying them...

Bro Areef,

I'd differ on this, as personally, I've know many ordinary bohras who willingly go forward and donate huge amounts to syedna, to gain barakat. They think by doing so, they'd make 3 times the money they have donated!! The same folks would never shell out a buck to help the needy and down-trodden.

Greed, being the driving force, takes control of everything. Kothar cleverly takes full advantage of this to fill their pockets.

[Aarif]

Br. LM,

If some mean people are doing this thinking that they will get 3-4 times more in return I feel sorry for them. But again even if they are wrong they need to be made aware and this can be done in a decent way. I think that is what real reformists are doing and fighting for. Trying to bring about positive awareness in the community by explaining their point of view instead of abusing the community at every opportunity they get.

[SBM]

Mr. Udaipurpresident
I think we have given you enough time to find,scan and post the article you talked about. It seems that there was no truth to your allegations and once again we have spin masters from Kothar just like Gulf before who could not produce any proof to his BAKWAS.
Please come clean and apologize just like Gulf had said that he got his story wrong.

[SBM]

The rumors I am talking, started by Gulf was about building of Zarih for Ma Fatema Zehra by Syedna and it came out to be false but at least towards end he confessed it was a hogwash.

[Al Zulfiqar]

this topic was started by udaipuri on 1st Feb. it is today, the 2nd of April. still he has not provided the newspaper clipping with the excuse of being away from udaipur.

by now, his credibility is in shreds and his lies exposed. under the guise of a reformist he was nothing but a kothari in sheep's clothing all along. udaipuri, yr silence is eloquent! how long are u going to keep hiding?